UK and the EU

Discussion in 'Off-Topic Discussion' started by clanless, Nov 9, 2015.

  1. wiseowl

    wiseowl Admin Staff Member

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    Good evening I have it on good authority the Vladimir would like to see us exit the EU;) that's one of the reasons why I will vote they we stay in;):blue thumb:
     
  2. pete

    pete Growing a bit of this and a bit of that....

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    But Trump is not a failed president. Yet:snork:
    Obama has achieve nothing much as far as I can tell.
    And has nothing to lose.

    And he can say what he likes, personally, but if it becomes the official line, ie, the US say we should stay "in", I doint think it will go down very well.
    Especially when you consider the whole point is, we dont want the EU telling us what to do.
    If he starts telling us what to do, who knows?
     
  3. pete

    pete Growing a bit of this and a bit of that....

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    I was under the impression Obama was coming over here, might be wrong.
    Dont think the ruskie is.
     
  4. ARMANDII

    ARMANDII Low Flying Administrator Staff Member

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    aCUT

    Well, I think Obama is only a "failed" President due to the peculiar political set up. The American people, as whole, voted for Democratic President, but within the borders of the individual States they voted, in the main, for Republican Congress men and Republican Senators. So they ended up with a Republican controlled Congress and Senate. That's a bit like having an English Prime Minister who can't decide anything because the two main opposition parties have got a larger majority than his party and can vote no every time. It's a crazy situation to vote in any Leader and then deny his the ability to make policies and decisions.:doh::snorky:
     
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    • ARMANDII

      ARMANDII Low Flying Administrator Staff Member

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      I would never let Putin and his cronies affect any decision I made, Woo!!:dunno:
       
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      • pete

        pete Growing a bit of this and a bit of that....

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        A hung parliament.over here.
        We all get those, and they are usually run by failed prime ministers.
        In other words, the bloke in charge is not overwhelmingly popular :biggrin:
         
      • ARMANDII

        ARMANDII Low Flying Administrator Staff Member

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        No, Pete, it is not a "hung" Parliament situation is the USA.:nonofinger::doh: The Republicans can, and have, veto any Democratic policy they want to and so far they have done so in every policy that a Democratic President has done....the name Obama is a misnomer in that it could be any name if it belonged to a Democratic President. Having said that a lot of the Republican extremists brought race, place of birth, and even alleging that Obama was a Muslim so there was an extra edge of malice in his case.:dunno::coffee::snork:
         
      • clueless1

        clueless1 member... yep, that's what I am:)

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        Putin is not as bad as many, many leaders that we take no interest in, or worse, knowingly accept as trusted allies.

        Sure he is not to be trusted. Like a certain recent British pm who started a war that we're still fighting, on the back of a pack of lies. Or a certain middle eastern leader who thinks it's fine to physically beat people for saying the wrong thing, but he's ok because he's a big customer of ours.

        It seems to me that Putin is not a nice man, but compared to many, he is ok. In the Russia/Ukraine situation, everyone seems to have forgotten that the people of Ukraine violently overthrew their elected pm, who happened to be opposed to the eu. This sparked counter protests by other people of Ukraine that didn't like the fact that their elected leader had been forced to run, in genuine fear for his life. So Ukrainian people physically fought Ukrainian people. Some of whom wanted to join the eu, some pined for the former Soviet union and to be called Russian. Pro eu Ukrainians had demonstrated their readiness to resort to violence against their pro Russian counterparts, their actual neighbours in their own towns. The eu, NATO, and everyone else in the 'west' made it clear that it was acceptable for pro eu Ukrainians to resort to violence, but not ok for pro Russian Ukrainians to retaliate or defend themselves. So what is Putin to do? He can't ignore what amounts to his own people, his own loyal citizens. But he can't openly intervene without NATO jumping on him, so he unofficially provides volunteer support to the pro Russian Ukrainians that are under threat.

        Then more recently, remembering the power vacuum created by Blair and Bush, and how it has been filled by a very evil movement, alongside internal violence in several countries most notably Syria, our side messes about and makes no progress while thousands are being killed. Putin mobilises forces, and within just a few months, there are peace talks on, for the first time since war broke out in Syria 5 years ago.

        Putin is a dodgy chap. But is he less trustworthy than Obama or Cameron? I don't know, but it seems he's achieved more, and more openly, than many leaders on our side.
         
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        • pete

          pete Growing a bit of this and a bit of that....

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          Well the SDP did a pretty good job of scuppering a vote in the commons recently.
          And it was a vote about a subject that had no bearing on what would happen in Scotland.
          So we all have these kinds of governmental problems at the moment, as I say, the bloke in charge is not usually that well liked.

          Got a feeling its only going to get worse, until all countries that run so called democracy, actually come up with some leaders with backbone, instead of ones that beat about the bush all the time.

          But then most of those countries have tied the hands of their leaders with PC laws that they have to follow.
          In the words of Private Frazer, we're doomed, we're doomed.:biggrin:
           
        • ARMANDII

          ARMANDII Low Flying Administrator Staff Member

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          You're talking about a President {Vladimir Viadirmirovich Putin] an ex Lieutenant Colonel in the KGB, Clueless, who annexed a country [Crimea] and who then deliberately started a war in the Ukraine as a diversion causing the West to fixate on that war rather than his invasion. He didn't actually become a Billionaire in the process by being a peace loving uncorrupted Politician:dunno: This is the guy who has intensified the attempted intrusions of Russian bombers into UK airspace and re-instigated the new Cold War and has relied on the high price of oil to support his political policies........yep, he's definitely not that bad!!:dunno::heehee:
           
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          • clueless1

            clueless1 member... yep, that's what I am:)

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            BBC northwest must have different news to Tyne Tees. Ours showed footage of regular Ukrainians actually lifting paving stones so they they could use lumps of concrete to smash public buildings, or throwing petrol bombs at the police. All while our side sort of said yeah ok.

            I didn't say Putin was alright. I said he is no worse than many on our side. Clearly he'd like to see the collapse of the eu. Why wouldn't he? The eu is trying to squeeze Russia out of existence financially and diplomatically. Bizarrely attempting to do so, despite the fact that Russia sells us much of the gas we burn, and Russia is a very important partner on some massive science projects with us. Any sensible eu would have Russia as a close ally, but instead they try to make an enemy.
             
          • Jack McHammocklashing

            Jack McHammocklashing Sludgemariner

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            It really makes no difference to Putin if we are in or out of the EU We remain in NATO

            @silu I took heed of the bet and bet three Sturgeon Euro to One British pound back

            I seems once in a Generation, was referring to the life span of a mouse
            So Gnasher Sturgeon is going for another go in August
             
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            • ARMANDII

              ARMANDII Low Flying Administrator Staff Member

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              I don't think it was the West that created the Iron Curtain, built up a vast army, backed North Korea, has assassinated it's political opponents, either by shooting down in public or using radioactive materials to do so. Russia has not forgiven the West in helping Poland, Ukraine, etc slip from under the Russian Boot and despite the fact that Putin and his cronies have used Western Gangster methods to acquire power, control of Oil Companies, and huge personal finances they hypocritically hide behind the illusion of Communism and the spectre of a free West.
              That has happened, not all that long ago, in London, Manchester, Liverpool and some other towns and cities:dunno: And I don't think any citizen is "regular" when involved in a civil war when one side is being helped with soldiers, missiles, arms, etc.:snorky:
               
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              • clueless1

                clueless1 member... yep, that's what I am:)

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                A bit like when our closest ally, with whom we have a special relationship, somehow elected companies owned by relatives of the elite to manage the oil infrastructure on behalf of the country we helped liberate. Good job we did, because as we all know, the country whose oil infrastructure we helped 'secure' was at the time being run by a maniac who had an arsenal of WMDs that could be turned on us with just 45 minutes notice.

                Still, that's all in the past now. More important now is the small matter of the 2 billion quid we've just offered as a bribe to China to be out friend.
                 
              • ARMANDII

                ARMANDII Low Flying Administrator Staff Member

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                I doubt if the measly sum of 2 Billion pounds as a "bribe" would have any effect as they have already got a more than 6 Billion pound stake in the Hinkley Power Station, 12 Billion in the HS2 project, and other numerous investments.:dunno::heehee:
                 
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