Brexit - am I stupid or what?

You are right @longk - it is democratic, only it is not democratic for us as we have no say in who gets elected to these various parts of the EU.

 

But surely remaining signed up to that would virtually negate us leaving?

 

No, sorry, longk................we are not signed up members of the Schengen agreement. Those members of the EU that are are........Belgium, Czech Republic, Denmark, Germany, Estonia, Greece, France, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Hungary, Malta, Netherlands, Austria, Poland, Portugal, Slovenia, Slovakia, Finland, Sweden and Iceland

"The Schengen Agreement (English: /ˈʃɛŋən/) is a treaty which led to the creation of Europe's Schengen Area, in which internal border checks have largely been abolished. It was signed on 14 June 1985, near the town of Schengen, Luxembourg, by five of the ten member states of the then European Economic Community."

 

I try not to join in any of these discussions as I keep my arguing outside of GC - where possible. What I occasionally do is just state facts.

The UK and Eire have opted out of Schengen.

The UK wants to maintain its own borders, and Eire chose to preserve its free movement arrangement with the UK - called the Common Travel Area - rather than join Schengen. That was, in essence, part of the Good Friday Agreement.

What we did opt in to is the Schengen Information System (SIS) which is the information exchange on typical police type topics.

 

Oh, just get in line, longk, I'm the bloke at the very front of the line of Plonkers



most of the people immediately behind me are the EU Hierarchy anyway.

 

Some of those people in that queue look a bit too close to each other. Especially if they've got plonkers!

 

Try looking at VAPP (Veterans and Peoples Party); not perfect but have some solid ideas at least and they can't be worse than any other option at this point.

 

For once, I find myself agreeing with her - it is all well and good saying no, or saying it won't work, but completely unacceptable to do so without saying why it won't work, or indeed making a counter proposal.

That is the very reason people like me would be no good at these sort of negotiations, as they would get told where to shove it, and to sing for their £39bn

 

I watched the Politics programme yesterday (sad, I know ) and Dominic Raab, Brexit Secretary, came across as being very good and handled the questions and attacks by the panel extremely well.

@Fat Controller He said exactly what you have said. He more or less said that we can't keep wasting our time coming up with proposals if the EU won't say anything but 'No'! They need to make some sort of positive comment - even if it's 'don't bother'.

I think that Raab is a good up and coming politician. He seems personable, stays calm and puts forward a cogent argument - even if you don't necessarily agree with him.