Corona Virus Treatment

Discussion in 'Off-Topic Discussion' started by ricky101, Feb 10, 2020.

  1. Fat Controller

    Fat Controller 'Cuddly' Scottish Admin! Staff Member

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    Of course we are @Upsydaisy :) Its all just a discussion, no falling out here, not with anyone - - - the whole point of any discussion forum is that we can share and air our views, and debate them amongst ourselves (even sometimes quite robustly) but at the end of it all we remain friends. That is one of the really good things about GC is that the members behave in an adult manner - there are many discussion platforms around where this would have descended into complete chaos.

    Agreed, it is not flu - however flu also has the ability to mutate and in itself can be fatal, and therein was part of my point. So far in the UK, the death rate is 44,000 people - an utterly horrific loss of life by anyone's standards, however put that against a moderately bad flu season of circa 30,000 and it gives some perspective to it; we don't lock all the vulnerable folks down throughout the flu season, nor do we shut all the shops etc, although maybe there should have been some sort of action taken. I fully appreciate that this is very much an unknown situation however, and that this virus could have been so much worse than flu.

    I also agree that percentages are a bit of a blunt instrument - if you have one person dying in one week and then two the following week, that is an increase of 100% which makes it sound even worse; sadly, however, that is the way that our lives are ran and it also gives a reasonable clue as to our chances of meeting someone that is carrying the virus.
     
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    • Fat Controller

      Fat Controller 'Cuddly' Scottish Admin! Staff Member

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      I think to some degree that is where I am (although I am not saying it very well here!) - here in the UK the death toll rose by 137 today. Clearly not good, however the overall death rate for all causes has apparently returned to normal against the seasonal average. Since the start of all this, 44k have sadly died - nobody can make light of anyone's death, however that is 44k out of a population of over 65 million people. We are never told how many people have recovered.

      We are told that if someone is infected and carrying the virus, they should have it out of their system in 14 days, so why would a three week TOTAL lockdown (and not the half-hearted business we have had here) not work? I can only assume that would be due to reinfection once people began travelling in from other countries.

      Even right at the start, when it was said that only essential workers should be going to work, we had things like the grass verges being trimmed in our street (nice to see done, but not exactly life threatening if not) and of course workers carried on building HS2 stuff, and working on various building sites....... all sorts carried on regardless, so is it a surprise that we still have the virus amongst us? When the air ambulances had to land at Durdle Door - everyone there was crushed up into a couple of really large crowds - - why were they not escorted to their cars and sent home instead? And why is it OK for thousands of people to congregate in Hyde Park of a weekend to protest, but it is not OK for some of us to speak to our next door neighbours?
       
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      • Islander77

        Islander77 Keen Gardener

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        Of course not. But no one here can do anything about that so why agonise about it? All we can each and all do is take precautions and stay well. ie heed the advice. Support and help each other.

        NB I did not ask or need you to explain anything! It was a question not needing an explanation! I knew fine well what your reaction would be. Again, why? What do you hope to gain?
         
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      • Islander77

        Islander77 Keen Gardener

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        There is no " could have been".

        And using cold percentages as you do is utterly cold and disrespectful to all who have lost loved ones; as at least two of us in this thread have, as we have said openly here. Our dear ones downgraded to meaningless stats to prove the situation is not bad?

        dehumanising

        And even now waiting to hear if two more well known to me are through quarantine without this appalling disease emerging?

        Your last sentence? If you take the prescribed precautions there is no need for theoretical avoidances.
         
      • Islander77

        Islander77 Keen Gardener

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        PS. there is a strong male/female divide on the thread. Interesting.
         
      • pete

        pete Growing a bit of this and a bit of that....

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        I'm off to watch some paint dry.
        Might be back tomorrow.;)
         
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        • Fat Controller

          Fat Controller 'Cuddly' Scottish Admin! Staff Member

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          Could the same be said for those that catch flu? They should take similar precautions to not catch it?

          I have not disrespected, dehumanised or belittled anyone's loss - - of course it is terrible to lose a friend or a loved one, and those that have lost have my every sympathy, and to be honest I find it quite disrespectful to be made out to be somehow callous or cold in that respect. I sincerely wish those you are waiting to hear about well, and quickly.

          Whether we like it or not, at government level - even within the NHS in fact - we are all a statistic somewhere, and it is those statistics that are being used to drive the thinking and the policy through this whole horrid situation.

          Equally, when it all boils down to it, someone has to pay for the support required - if the economy collapses completely, be it at a local or a national level, people suffer. My own council for example are currently warning that they are on the brink of bankruptcy because of Covid-19. If they are bankrupt, who is going to look after the 98 year old chap who lives just across the road from me? Or the 78 year old next door to him who has dementia? As it stands at the moment, we all keep a weather-eye out for him when he goes a wandering, but we cannot always be there.
           
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          • NigelJ

            NigelJ Total Gardener

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            Because we still have policing by consent and an unarmed police force. It is often impractical/impossible for a police force, particularly outside the London area, to gather the numbers required to clear large crowds. Even the Met calls in support from the rest of the country for dealing with large demonstrations and that requires notice and planning. So a rapidly organised crowd (by social media etc) poses a problem do you break it up and risk widespread disorder or do you supervise it and keep it safe, only arresting obvious trouble makers where possible.
             
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            • Fat Controller

              Fat Controller 'Cuddly' Scottish Admin! Staff Member

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              Fair point @NigelJ, particularly about widespread disorder, but I am sure you will agree that is not helped when some forces actively state that they are facilitating a protest rather than reminding people of the law that no more than six people can attend. The risks to the officers as well as those protesting in terms of passage of infection must be huge, and that goes right back to the mixed messages about the severity of this virus.
               
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              • Mike Allen

                Mike Allen Total Gardener

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                Well I had a nice surprise this morning. I was booked for an appointment at Cardiology at Guy's. Due to the Covi-19 problem. Face to face consultaions have been suspended, where possible.
                So the house phone comes to life. It was a doctor from the hospital. Thankfully and no disrespect to our multi national hospital staff. Who without their loyal and devoted endurance. This country would never have coped as it has, with this pandemic. He spoke very clearly and I was able to understand him.

                It turns out that my heart problem, Aortic stenosis is rated as moderate. That provided I don't start blacking out, or have shortness of breath and chest pains. It is estimated that this old so and so may well have 3-4 yrs ahead without surgical intervention. I will be having an audio heart scan in Oct/Nov just to keep an eye on things. So, Mike suddenly felt as if that sack of spuds had been lifted off my back. So 3-4 yrs time. Hey ho! 83/4 not bad going. Hey ladies. Anyone for tennis?

                Now back to the pandemic debate.

                First and foremost. FC said: Its all just a discussion, no falling out here, not with anyone - - - the whole point of any discussion forum is that we can share and air our views, and debate them amongst ourselves (even sometimes quite robustly) but at the end of it all we remain friends. That is one of the really good things about GC is that the members behave in an adult manner - there are many discussion platforms around where this would have descended into complete chaos.

                I have had the pleasure of meeting FC and look forward to enjoying a long friendship with him.. He did once refer to me as being a scholar. To me. I am simply a proud member of Gardeners Corner Forum. The statement FC made is so true. There are many gardening forums on the internet. Trust me. This is by far the best.

                Now the pandemic etc. etc. etc. Yes I say, etc etc, etc, because this subject is destined to go on and on. Let's be fair. We don't know for just how long this virus was known about. Did it suddenly, out of the blue turn up in that market in China. News of it hit the headlines across the world. We understand that the center of the outbreak, an immediate shutdown was imposed. Then came the news that the virus had turned up in other countries. Soon after, people began dropping like flies.

                So in time the British population also find themselves in dire straights. Here we must consider the politicians. They have been elcted by the populus to make the rules etc to run this country. They make use of all advice and services available. Members are not in most cases, medics or scientists. In come the brainy lot, the Drs. & Profs. Even they have never before been confronted by such an outbreak.

                Here begins a completely new learning curve. Learning perhaps being the operative term. As we have all witnessed. This virus does not pick and choose. Much talk surrounds the common cold. After much sufferring a vaccine has been developed.

                I have a deep interest in medicine and medical research. In brief. The flue or common cold is debilitating etc , but not so invasive as Covid -19 a child of Sars. Covid-19 really goes for the throat, more precise it blasts the lungs.

                Once infected. The victim experiences breathing difficulties. As we know. The lungs oxiginate the blood that circulate our body. So basically any interruption with our air ways and the resulting obstruction to the blood flow can be a problem. Hidden away from us, that claret stuff we call blood, is not just a liquid. It contains so many cells that help feed and supply every part of our body. So such an infection will bring disaster to the whole body. Cells weaken. Limbs lose the power to act and in time even the brain starts to notice the lack of, the depletion of vital nutriens etc. As with all living things, including plants. The conception is. These now starved/deprived organs etc, close down. Next step...sadly. Lights out. Goodnight Vienna.

                So the scientist and medics are struggling to discover what is what. Back home. Boris and his parliament are really left holding the baby. These people DON'T KNOW. NEITHER DO YOU AND ME. HM Gov are doing their best. Changes of mind take place. Please try and keep your back to the wall. IMHO. None of us have the slightest inkling asto how this is will end.

                STAY SAFE> LUV YOU ALL.
                 
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                • pete

                  pete Growing a bit of this and a bit of that....

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                  Pictures on the news again this morning of police running down the streets chased by a bunch of rioters
                  last night.
                   
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                  • Fat Controller

                    Fat Controller 'Cuddly' Scottish Admin! Staff Member

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                    White City - not all that far from me really.

                    Keep you eye on areas such as Tooting, Streatham and Thornton Heath - I reckon they will surface in the news at some point.
                     
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                    • shiney

                      shiney President, Grumpy Old Men's Club Staff Member

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                      Take note that it's only in highly populated areas that there are idiots. Even in our village we had trouble the other week. Admittedly, it was imported from towns around but it still occurred.

                      One of the local places was serving drinks outside (allowed according to the guidelines) and the message went out through social media. A load of idiots turned up and eventually there was some fighting that turned nasty. Two fairly serious injuries occurred and we ended up with 12 police cars (according to the report :scratch: :th scifD36: - but there was at least six) and an air ambulance (luckily not required).

                      Apart from that one incident we have been blessed with people sticking to the guidelines. We have a large village green and when the weather was hot there were lots of families having picnics but keeping well distanced. These families came from the towns around us but were all well behaved. The local takeaways did a roaring trade, as did the pubs with taking orders and serving drinks in plastic containers. The bins around the green were used and everything was kept tidy.

                      Most people are good and follow the guidelines but it gets spoilt by idiots.
                       
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                      • NigelJ

                        NigelJ Total Gardener

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                        Not sure we have 12 police cars in all of Devon.
                         
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                        • shiney

                          shiney President, Grumpy Old Men's Club Staff Member

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                          I'll sell you some. :dbgrtmb: Just send a cheque. :whistle: :loll:
                           
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