Electric cars.

Discussion in 'Off-Topic Discussion' started by pete, Apr 7, 2021.

  1. Jocko

    Jocko Guided by my better half.

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2022
    Messages:
    2,417
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired engineer. Now Vice CEO of the garden.
    Location:
    Danderhall on southern edge of Edinburgh. Zone 8a.
    Ratings:
    +6,782
    Lithium is a relatively abundant element on Earth, but its availability in economically extractable concentrations varies. The majority of lithium resources are found in brine deposits in salt flats, particularly in South America, as well as in hard rock deposits in countries such as Australia, Canada, and China.

    Estimates of total lithium reserves on Earth vary, but they are generally believed to be around 17-20 million metric tons. However, it's important to note that lithium is not consumed like fossil fuels, but rather it is extracted and used in various applications, including batteries for electric vehicles and energy storage, ceramics, glass, and pharmaceuticals.

    As demand for lithium continues to grow due to its increasing use in batteries for electric vehicles and renewable energy storage, concerns have been raised about the long-term availability of lithium. The rate of lithium production would need to increase significantly to meet the projected demand in the coming decades. However, it's worth noting that lithium is a recyclable material and efforts to recycle lithium from used batteries are increasing, which could help to extend its availability.

    As for potential alternatives to lithium, researchers and companies are actively exploring and developing alternative battery technologies that do not rely on lithium, such as solid-state batteries, sodium-ion batteries, and magnesium-ion batteries. These technologies have the potential to offer comparable or even better performance than lithium-ion batteries, while potentially using more abundant and less expensive materials. However, these alternative technologies are still in the early stages of development and are not yet widely commercialized. Additionally, research into lithium extraction from unconventional sources, such as seawater or geothermal brines, is also ongoing.
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
    • pete

      pete Growing a bit of this and a bit of that....

      Joined:
      Jan 9, 2005
      Messages:
      51,133
      Gender:
      Male
      Occupation:
      Retired
      Location:
      Mid Kent
      Ratings:
      +94,088
      Just seen a bit on the news, this bloke was charging his van overnight from a lampost charger, he said it was costing 66p a Kwh but if he had a driveway he could probably only pay 7p a Kwh.
      Then they showed a bit where a company puts a channel across the pavement from your house and you can lay the cable in it, wonder what happens when somebody else parks outside your house?

      Most areas of older housing around here is pretty much a free for all to get street parking, even though I have a driveway, and all the houses around here do, I often have people parking overnight outside my house.
       
      • Agree Agree x 2
      • Loofah

        Loofah Admin Staff Member

        Joined:
        Feb 20, 2008
        Messages:
        13,963
        Gender:
        Male
        Location:
        Guildford
        Ratings:
        +24,430
        I think we keep coming back to the lack of infrastructure...
         
        • Agree Agree x 2
        • pete

          pete Growing a bit of this and a bit of that....

          Joined:
          Jan 9, 2005
          Messages:
          51,133
          Gender:
          Male
          Occupation:
          Retired
          Location:
          Mid Kent
          Ratings:
          +94,088
          But EVs need a massive infrastructure, not one you can build in 10 or 20yrs.
          How long did it take to get ICE infrastructure to where it is now.

          I still get the impression that it is to force the peasants off the roads.
           
        • pete

          pete Growing a bit of this and a bit of that....

          Joined:
          Jan 9, 2005
          Messages:
          51,133
          Gender:
          Male
          Occupation:
          Retired
          Location:
          Mid Kent
          Ratings:
          +94,088
          I foresee the government making life very difficult for those that still own ICE cars in the next 10 to 15 yrs, they are doing it already for those that have high emissions, and have been for some time.
          They will put the squeeze on, but EV owners will not be getting away with it either, because the government is going to have to get all that tax from somewhere and as they drive ICE vehicles off the roads, the burden will fall on EV owners who at the moment think everything is wonderful.
           
          • Agree Agree x 1
          • pete

            pete Growing a bit of this and a bit of that....

            Joined:
            Jan 9, 2005
            Messages:
            51,133
            Gender:
            Male
            Occupation:
            Retired
            Location:
            Mid Kent
            Ratings:
            +94,088
            I'm kind of pointing out that even home charging is pretty unrealistic for a lot of people, and TBH that is where most people are likely to be charging.
             
            • Agree Agree x 1
            • Fat Controller

              Fat Controller 'Cuddly' Scottish Admin! Staff Member

              Joined:
              May 5, 2012
              Messages:
              27,772
              Gender:
              Male
              Occupation:
              Public Transport
              Location:
              At me 'puter, GCHQ Ashford Office, Middlesex
              Ratings:
              +52,218
              I have a friend that has just had an EV foisted upon him through the Motability scheme, and he is currently dealing with councils and occupational health folks to try and get permission to put a driveway in at his house; he cannot just do it off his own back as it is a council house. Whilst the usual red tape tennis takes place, he is having to charge at public chargers costing anything up to 75p per kWh - put simply, besides being wholly inconvenient (he has to sit and wait for the car to charge before he can go home), it is going to cost him an arm and a leg, especially once the schools restart.

              It seems that the used market is not enamoured either - saw two very similar posts today, one was a massive discount on a pre-registered Ford Transit with 0 miles, and the other was this:

              Corsa.png
               
              • Like Like x 2
              • Informative Informative x 2
              • Jocko

                Jocko Guided by my better half.

                Joined:
                Jan 2, 2022
                Messages:
                2,417
                Gender:
                Male
                Occupation:
                Retired engineer. Now Vice CEO of the garden.
                Location:
                Danderhall on southern edge of Edinburgh. Zone 8a.
                Ratings:
                +6,782
                What they (and we) have to remember is that motorists are voters and if a party comes along that says ICE vehicles are here to stay that is a huge pool of voters that will get behind them. You can see how the current government reacted to their bacon being saved by London's ULEZ. Now the current Tory party is not as green as it was before the by-election result.
                 
                • Like Like x 1
                • Agree Agree x 1
                • pete

                  pete Growing a bit of this and a bit of that....

                  Joined:
                  Jan 9, 2005
                  Messages:
                  51,133
                  Gender:
                  Male
                  Occupation:
                  Retired
                  Location:
                  Mid Kent
                  Ratings:
                  +94,088
                  I dont think I would trust any prospective government in anything they say in their manifesto.
                  They just say what they think we want to hear, once they get the job they do as they like.
                   
                  • Agree Agree x 2
                  • pete

                    pete Growing a bit of this and a bit of that....

                    Joined:
                    Jan 9, 2005
                    Messages:
                    51,133
                    Gender:
                    Male
                    Occupation:
                    Retired
                    Location:
                    Mid Kent
                    Ratings:
                    +94,088
                    They will ramp up road tax year upon year, they will bring in more and more no emissions areas, so basically no go areas for non EVs, unless of course you are prepared to pay them money, then you can pollute if you want to.
                    They will ramp up fuel duty.
                    They will use every trick in the book and a few more yet to be invented to stop the use of ICE vehicles , and it doesn't matter who is in power, they will just want to get to the mythical carbon neutral.
                     
                  • Fat Controller

                    Fat Controller 'Cuddly' Scottish Admin! Staff Member

                    Joined:
                    May 5, 2012
                    Messages:
                    27,772
                    Gender:
                    Male
                    Occupation:
                    Public Transport
                    Location:
                    At me 'puter, GCHQ Ashford Office, Middlesex
                    Ratings:
                    +52,218
                    I just hope the grown-ups get involved properly and risk management significantly improves along with related infrastructure.
                     
                    • Like Like x 1
                    • gks

                      gks Total Gardener

                      Joined:
                      Feb 28, 2021
                      Messages:
                      1,733
                      Gender:
                      Male
                      Occupation:
                      Production Manager
                      Location:
                      Cumbria
                      Ratings:
                      +5,008
                      Which confirms the sales of BEV to the private sector are well below what we are lead to believe.
                      If it was not for all the perks for the business and fleet sector, the uptake in BEV's would be considerably lower than the current 16.1% market share.

                      From 2024 the trajectory for new BEV registrations comes into force with 22% of new car registrations having to be fully electric. The price for second hand BEV will inevitably continue to fall but if the private sector is already reluctant to purchase a BEV, will the big second hand car dealers be as keen to stock ex fleet and business BEV's in the future.

                      Industry calls for urgent support as electric car uptake slows | Autocar
                       
                    • burnie

                      burnie Total Gardener

                      Joined:
                      Jun 2, 2016
                      Messages:
                      1,213
                      Gender:
                      Male
                      Occupation:
                      Retired engineer
                      Location:
                      Angus, NE Scotland
                      Ratings:
                      +5,655
                      • Funny Funny x 2
                      • Like Like x 1
                      • Fat Controller

                        Fat Controller 'Cuddly' Scottish Admin! Staff Member

                        Joined:
                        May 5, 2012
                        Messages:
                        27,772
                        Gender:
                        Male
                        Occupation:
                        Public Transport
                        Location:
                        At me 'puter, GCHQ Ashford Office, Middlesex
                        Ratings:
                        +52,218
                        I wonder if some of the exorbitant prices that we have been seeing are deliberately over-inflated, knowing that the backside simply has to drop out of prices for it to be viable? That Corsa is a prime example - £36k, for a Corsa is just insanity, so the market simply has to reset... or, are they doing that so they can pre-register the cars to reach their targets and then try to sell them with next to zero miles on them as used cars at their *real* price?

                        The other significant problem for used buyers is that they aren't likely to see the deals where home chargers are installed at a discounted price - so that will further make people reluctant.. and that is before we get to those who simply cannot and never will be able to charge at home (along with various other questions that never get a sensible answer)
                         
                        • Informative Informative x 1
                        • Retired

                          Retired Some people are so poor all they have is money

                          Joined:
                          May 30, 2019
                          Messages:
                          1,678
                          Gender:
                          Male
                          Occupation:
                          Retired.
                          Location:
                          West Yorkshire
                          Ratings:
                          +5,898
                          • Agree Agree x 2
                          Loading...

                          Share This Page

                          1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
                            By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
                            Dismiss Notice