Latest Moan From You and Me 2024

Discussion in 'Off-Topic Discussion' started by JWK, Jan 1, 2024.

  1. JWK

    JWK Gardener Staff Member

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    A couple of my nephews are policemen, one in the Met was on his only family holiday he could manage this year when he was recalled because of the riots. It's not fair on them, they work extraordinary long hours normally then to find all leave cancelled is awful. They are just ordinary folk doing their best so please don't lay the blame on them.
     
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    • Loofah

      Loofah Admin Staff Member

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      Do they get holidays refunded?
       
    • JWK

      JWK Gardener Staff Member

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      I would hope so but I've no idea, they never talk about it. It's the only way to stay sane to leave their problems at work not bring them home. Only found out his holiday was cancelled because my brother was with them camping together.
       
    • fairygirl

      fairygirl Total Gardener

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      Money isn't always the answer, because it can't replace that time with his family @JWK.
      I know many people have varying opinions about the Police, depending on their personal experiences, but I can honestly say that mine has all been very good, on the few occasions I've needed their help, especially when escaping a serious situation.
      Having said that - my ex BIL joined the force, and he's a total a88ehole. Even his own [very large] family has basically disowned him, including his own children.
      Good and bad in every institution, and walk of life.
       
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      • RowlandsCastle

        RowlandsCastle Total Gardener

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        I remember being told (asked politely, but firmly) to relinquish my holiday because the office were short staffed. I reminded the managing director that I was going to be on my honeymoon.
        I never did tell him that I was only going to be away for 10 days. I just told him I had booked two weeks, and I'd be in on the Monday. If he'd found out I would be home sooner, I'd have been called in.
        Any other holiday would have been cancelled - but financially reimbursed. Nothing to cover the loss of enjoyment.
        Admittedly, once I returned, I was spending more nights in London hotels, than at home with my wife. That went on for a couple of months.
        NOT HAPPY!!
         
      • ViewAhead

        ViewAhead Head Gardener

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        I'm not laying the blame on individuals. I'm saying everyone should be treated fairly within the system of law and order. That is the basis of democracy.
         
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        • JWK

          JWK Gardener Staff Member

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          My Gt Grandfather was a station sergeant at Sunbury and by all accounts not a nice person being polite. I never knew him but he was good at dividing the family, some of the rifts still exist. Good and bad as you say.
           
        • JWK

          JWK Gardener Staff Member

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          OK which one of you has defaced the rhino Banksy ? I have a list ...
           
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          • pete

            pete Growing a bit of this and a bit of that....

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            Wherever I worked it was always a case of putting in your holiday months in advance if possible, if you left it late you may not have the date you wanted, if it left them short handed.

            I agree, though it does seem strange that the legal system can get things moving if pushed, but most of the time just hang things out in order to make money, for certain individuals, all in the name of giving someone a fair trial.
             
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            • shiney

              shiney President, Grumpy Old Men's Club Staff Member

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              I understand that most of these early convictions have gone through very quickly because they pleaded guilty. That saves the courts an enormous amount of time and money and the miscreant gets a reduced sentence.
               
            • pete

              pete Growing a bit of this and a bit of that....

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              Agree, but under normal circumstances they would have reached court in about a years time probably.
               
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              • shiney

                shiney President, Grumpy Old Men's Club Staff Member

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                Possibly, but the ulterior motive was to 'pour encourage les autres' and it certainly seemed to have cut back on the 'riots'. :blue thumb:
                 
              • ViewAhead

                ViewAhead Head Gardener

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                But that works the other way too. Take 3 yrs to bring a rape case to court, or fail to prosecute at all, and that effectively says such offences have no priority in the system. Allow shoplifting to go uninvestigated but leap on looters and that says it is fine to steal but do it in broad daylight when the premises in question are open for business and don't be part of a group. And so on.

                Plus, most defendants have the circumstances of their offending considered - how they came to that point, influences from their background cirs, and so on. That seems to be completely missing here. So, if you murder someone, your mental state at the time will be taken into account; if you riot, it seems not.

                And further, the psychology of crowd behaviour needs to be weighted in. People behave different in an angry crowd setting.

                I'm not condoning riots at all. But the justice system must be fair or you further alienate the people you most need to accept its values.
                 
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                • pete

                  pete Growing a bit of this and a bit of that....

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                  Now you've gone all funny.
                  You've been watching the Olympics.:biggrin:
                   
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                  • pete

                    pete Growing a bit of this and a bit of that....

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                    I think the biggest thing that stopped the riots was the crowds that came out on the streets in counter protests.
                    Starmer is obviously going to say it was his doing, but it was probably a case of social media working for the good as well as the bad.

                    Totally agree @ViewAhead this has now set a president and if Starmer want to think its the courts that have stopped the riots he his going to have to get his finger out and sort the back log.
                    He is also going to have to come up with harsher sentences for other criminals instead of slapped wrists.
                     
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