Electric cars.

Discussion in 'Off-Topic Discussion' started by pete, Apr 7, 2021.

  1. Fat Controller

    Fat Controller 'Cuddly' Scottish Admin! Staff Member

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  2. KT53

    KT53 Gardener

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    Reading a report from What Car on their comparison of summer temperature and winter temperature range effect on EVs. I think everybody is aware that batteries in general can struggle in cold weather, but a range reduction of between 25% and over 30% came as a surprise to me.
     
  3. pete

    pete Growing a bit of this and a bit of that....

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    Presumably a lot of that will be using things like heater and wipers etc. that you dont use in good weather.
     
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    • Perki

      Perki Total Gardener

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      I were reading about sodium ion batteries the other day , they are supposedly much better with extreme temperatures . They are some cars already in china with the sodium ion battery but weight can be a problem. I'd have a leccy van I don't do loads of miles in a day 10 mile or less , but I've got my eye on a PHEV instead transit custom but they are £45k for a work van :hate-shocked: it be many years before I could afford one or a full leccy one the price of vehicle's now are outrageous .

      My friend has a BMW leccy car/suv he likes it pays for it with salary sacrifice, he just been on a cruise from Southampton 230mile journey there so he were making plans to stop to recharge and I suppose recharge before coming back and charge again halfway. My 3 ton van could probably do the journey there and back and then back to Southampton on 1 tank :heehee:
       
    • gks

      gks Total Gardener

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      Which then increases more PM2.5 particles into the atmosphere through tyre wear.
      For every 1000 pounds a car increase's in weight, tyre wear increases by 20%. So no pollution through the tailpipe, but increased pollution through extra torque and a heavier vehicle increases tyre wear on an EV.

      Very similar to countries that have very cold conditions, studded tyres reduces accidents and injuries, but the down side other illness increase due to poor air quality, plus the extra costs to maintain the roads. A trade off that some countries take into account regarding studded tyres where they only allow them for certain times of the year and encourage motorists in urban areas not to use them at all.

      I have been reading articles about how poor the BEV uptake is so poor in the UK compared to Norway and how we should see them as an example of leading from the front.

      Well for starters, they have offered all sorts of subsidies to encourage the uptake in BEV's, but I wonder how many would be on their roads if they weren't a major exporter in fossil fuels. When that and the subsidies dries up in the future, what will the EV market be.

      An abstract below from an article I read, which also went on to say. If the rest of the world copied the country overnight, the Norwegians would be out of business. Norway is Western Europe’s largest oil and gas exporter, and the revenue lost from tax breaks on Teslas is dwarfed by the $15 billion-plus the government receives annually from the country’s energy sales.


      The Norwegians are burning less oil, but they need everyone else to keep burning it. The more, the better, so as to pay for Norway’s EV “miracle.” That’s why Norway remains Western Europe’s #1 exporter of fossil fuels.
      Even Transport Minister Ketil Solvik-Olsen admits it’s the devil’s argument.

      “Yes, we made a lot of money on oil,” Solvik-Olsen told Bloomberg, “but we know there are downsides to the product, and we try to take the world to the next level.”

      If Norway’s shift is paid for exporting the very pollution they want to expunge, any moral argument on behalf of electrification is nullified. If and when the export markets dry up, Norway’s ability and/or desire to subsidize EV sales will evaporate. That’s how economics works.
       
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      • ViewAhead

        ViewAhead Head Gardener

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        Also, it is slightly easier to make progress when you have a population of 5 million (approx). The same “progress” here would involve roughly 20-fold more take-up.
         
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        • gks

          gks Total Gardener

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          Correct, if you compare the number of fully electric cars registered in Norway compared to Ireland, its 10 fold greater with very similar populations and also have subsidies towards the private buyer. Then you look at the air quality of both nations, they are the same, however Oslo as a city has one of the poorest air qualities in the world, certainly in Europe. I know other factors come in to place but for a country that has the highest uptake in BEV'S I would of thought that the air quality in Norway as a whole would of been much cleaner than Ireland.
           
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          • Fat Controller

            Fat Controller 'Cuddly' Scottish Admin! Staff Member

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            It is part of the reason that the company I work for is about to change to a different vehicle supplier - the current one sold a dream and then didn't really back it up; the charge management has never been fully right, the software that was supposed to give detailed overview.. doesn't and last winter we ended up with numerous vehicles running out of charge to the point where we had one route pulled completely by 7pm... not good for a London route that is supposed to run every 15 mins in the evening.
             
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            • gks

              gks Total Gardener

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              I see Dover District Council are to introduce a flat rate permit fee for off street parking. Instead of discounting low emission vehicle less and more for those producing more emissions, which they had been doing previously, it will now be a flat rate of £105 for all vehicles. This will be a 162% increase for zero emission cars and a 12% reduction for cars producing the most emissions.
               
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              • Nigel coad

                Nigel coad Apprentice Gardener

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                I was somewhat surprised to see Oslo being described as a very polluted city, which did not fit with my experience.
                This is a recent illustration of pollution levels
                airqual.JPG
                 
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              • KT53

                KT53 Gardener

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                On stats I've just looked at Oslo doesn't appear in the 25 worst capital cities in Europe regarding pollution.
                 
              • Allotment Boy

                Allotment Boy Lifelong Allotmenteer

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                Our two cars one is 18 this year the other will be 11, petrol both still ULEZ compliant, both bought new, cash. Wouldn't do it now.
                 
              • gks

                gks Total Gardener

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                A couple of years ago Sweden was one of the most expensive countries in Europe for Fuel. In 2022 a litre of diesel was costing over €2.00 a litre and peaked at nearly €2.6 a litre. Now with cuts in taxes and another cut this year, Sweden is now one of the cheapest countries for fuel in Europe, the latest cut in taxes has resulted in some garages having empty pumps as people stock up, wonder what Greta Thunberg thinks.

                Sweden's Gasoline Boom Leads to Empty Pumps Across the Country
                 
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