Use of seeds containing Thiram

Hi All,

First post...! I moved house last year and am busy installing new beds and a greenhouse in time for thr growing season, so hoping this forum will be very useful for me as a part time novice at best!

My father in law has just returned from India with a number of seed packets (purchased from a store) he was very excited about, including gourds and pumpkins. I noticed that all the packets were marked with a warning that they contained Thiram.

Thanks to google, I can see that sales of seeds containing Thiram were banned in the UK in 2019, and their use banned in Jan 20 (which I assume was for commercial use rather than private, unless I am risking breaking the law!). I can't really find too much on 'why', other than along with many other fungacides the impact of Thiram is categorised as unknown.

I am contemplating starting them off and then handing them back to him, I have told him about the ban, but he isn't bothered...! Does anyone have any views around using these seeds given the ban, would you risk it, or is it best to discard?

 

Personally I wouldn't be too bothered, I assume, without checking that Thiram is banned in the UK and probably Europe.

It's probably used as a seed dressing to stop them rotting.

I'm sure some people would not use them.
Often you get a warning on seed because the seeds are edible and it's to stop people eating them as they are for growing only.

 

From Google-

Thiram is banned in the UK due to concerns about its potential harm to the environment, particularly its toxicity to pollinators like bees, as well as potential health risks associated with its use, leading to regulatory decisions to restrict or completely ban its application in agriculture.
Key points about Thiram's ban:

• Environmental impact:
  Thiram is considered a significant threat to pollinators, with studies showing potential negative effects on bee health even at low exposure levels.
• EU regulations:
  The UK, as a former EU member, aligns with EU regulations that have largely banned thiram due to its environmental concerns.
• Precautionary principle:
  Even with limited conclusive evidence, the UK tends to prioritize caution when it comes to potentially harmful chemicals like thiram.

 

I personally wouldn’t use them. I’d hand them back to FIL. On a practical side, they may not grow well here anyway if they’re varieties used to such a different climate.

Or you might be able to buy UK seeds of the same varieties and he’ll be none the wiser. Unless you’ve lots of space you wouldn’t be able to grow a lot of each one or lots of different varieties anyway as each individual plant would need quite a bit of space and in a sunny spot. It wouldn’t take many to fill your average greenhouse or vegetable plot

 

I think if the seeds were mine, they'd go in the household waste bin.

In addition to having a banned substance on them there's the ever-present risk of introducing a new plant pathogen to the UK -

From Google-
Yes, there are restrictions on bringing seeds into the UK from outside the EU, including India. You may need an official certificate or license to bring in seeds, plants, soil, and other plant products.
Why are there restrictions?

• To prevent the spread of plant pests, pathogens, and diseases
• To protect endangered species

What do I need to bring seeds into the UK?

• Health certificate
  A health certificate issued by the plant protection service in the country of origin
• Import license
  A specific import license issued by the appropriate agricultural department
• CITES permit
  A permit if the food or animal products are protected by the Convention on International Trade in Endangered Species of Wild Fauna and Flora (CITES)

What are the penalties? Unlimited fines and Imprisonment.

Who can I contact for more information? The Animal and Plant Health Agency (APHA), The Food and Environment Research Agency, and Species+.

You can check if you need a CITES permit on GOV.UK.

 

Completely agree @Pete8. Bringing in unlicensed seeds from any country is illegal for many good reasons. It's also thoughtless with no regard to the potential consequences from unquarantined, non-sanitised seeds and plant material.

 

Altho I've never before come across Thiram, I'd certainly agree with the above posts and not risk sowing the seeds here.
I'd thank your FIL but explain the issue to him. There are plenty of Pumpkin/Gourd seed suppliers here in the UK so not worth the risk.

 

While one should be concerned regarding the apparent offences of importation; and if you proceed, of use of the aforementioned seeds, in practical terms you are not placing yourself especially at risk by growing , and perhaps, consuming the produce.
After all, most of the imported foodstuffs introduced in to UK (that is the 45% that we do not grow) are grown using substances which it is forbidden by law to use in this country and although technically they should be tested for, current Govt. policy is not to be rigorous in this respect.
Amongst current discord within the agricultural industry is this fact. Not only are they at a technical disadvantage in standing the cost of this loss, they are required to pay to show that they do not use such substances yet receive only world prices set by foreign producers where no such verification is done.

 

@dadio77 , maybe you should turn yourself in before the police turn up.

I think most of our recently introduced plant and tree diseases have arrived from EU countries via legal importation.

 

I'd suggest it's not so much putting yourself at risk by growing and consuming the products from the seeds mentioned, but it is taking into account the possibility of introducing a banned substance into a wider area.
Whilst our importation checks are certainly not as rigorous as one would hope, why encourage people to be just as lax and ignore the rules ?
The OP was quite open in asking what to do for the best and it would seem the answer is No

 

Thanks all, I appreciate the number of replies and additional considerations.

I also asked my wife if she would feed our daughter from whatever is harvested and she wouldn't, she suggested telling FIL none had grown instead - not sure I can cope with the ignominy of appearing to be a failed gardener, but may well take the easy way out and drop a white lie for the greater good!

 

I can send you some delicata and sweet lightning (from shop) seeds in a week if you want. only a few though. also have a small white pumpkin that is good raw if you have a strong jaw. also have some small cucumbers

the worst diseases have mostly come from huge legal imports by reckless corporate importers who lost the numbers game. millions of box was imported by germans and dutch from - guess where, china. goodbye british box

 

@dadio77 you could just tell him it's illegal and unsafe and ask him never to import seeds again. If he's a reasonable man he shouldn't be offended but be grateful for the information.

 

People may be attracted to plants that proudly display 'Grown in the UK' on labels.
But what does that mean??
Answer is that as long as the plant has spent 'some time' growing in the UK it can be labelled as Grown in the UK even if it was grown outside of the UK and spent most of its life outside of the UK....

Further info here -

What 'grown in the UK' really means.. PlantPlots Garden Design