Thai bonsai

Discussion in 'Trees' started by sal73, Feb 20, 2012.

  1. sal73

    sal73 Total Gardener

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    I would love to start a long term project and grow some Thai bonsais , can anyone suggest me a plant similar to the one in the picture but frost hardy (the one in the picture is a Ficus Microcarpa ) or with a behaving roots ?
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
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    • JWK

      JWK Gardener Staff Member

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      I've been reading 'Niwaki' by Jake Hobbs and for the UK he recommends Phillyrea latifolia. I just purchased a young whip plant a few weeks ago and have made a start on the training/pruning last weekend, in 25 years time I might be considered to know what I'm talking about, right now I'm very much at the learning stage. I have seen some of the Phillyrea latifolia as mature plants at specialist nurseries, they look really good and are everygreen and hardy in the south of england (should be OK for you in Bedford). The main thing for me is that they have a reasonable growth rate.

      I also bought a young whip of Luma apiculata (Orange barked Myrtle), because it has lovely bark colouring and texture. Again that is used for this cloud pruning (Niwaki), but it is slighlty tender and can lose it's leaves over winter so I'm told.

      The other main one grown 'for' the UK is Ilex crenata, but that is very slow growing and I understand mostly it is imported from Japan. I looked and looked and couldn't find any young untrained plants for sale in the UK.

      Here's where I got my plants, they are a mine of information and well worth a vist: Architectural Plants: Niwaki

      I took some photos at the nursery a few years ago, I'll try and find them and post them here if I can find them. I really wish I'd started then (it was 10 years ago :thumbsup:)
       
    • JWK

      JWK Gardener Staff Member

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      I can't help you with that second photo, I can't think of anything in the UK with roots like that!
       
    • JWK

      JWK Gardener Staff Member

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      Ah, just found a photo I took in May 2002 at Architectural Plants, of the Ilex crenata:
      [​IMG]

      I've also got a photo of the price tag for this one too, you probably don't want to know ... :)
       
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      • sal73

        sal73 Total Gardener

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        John what about buxus , do you recon will it work ? I`ve seen bonsai of buxus and they look pretty easy and absolutly frost hardy.
         
      • JWK

        JWK Gardener Staff Member

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        Yes I was going to mention Buxus, very cheap and hardy. So they make a forgiving subject to practise on and are totally hardy. They are used in topiary and only need a clip twice a year to keep looking very neat.
         
      • JWK

        JWK Gardener Staff Member

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        Here's the price tag of the tree in post#4 :sunny:

        [​IMG]

        :)
         
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        • sal73

          sal73 Total Gardener

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          No go on that`s a joke!!!!!!!! £6450 for a plant that look like a £5 buxus plant???????? it`s japanese holly ...... did it come all the way from japan by taxi???????
           
        • Anthorn

          Anthorn Gardener

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          I don't think you're going to find a sub-tropical to tropical tree that's frost hardy. Usually we keep tropical bonsai indoors only moving them outside if the temperature and humidy is right which isn't very often. The only one I can think of which might be of interest is Ficus Ginseng which has similar roots but not similar top growth. It's the perfect house-plant because it works well in shady well-lit areas and also full sun but is propagated by chopping off a bit of the stem of an existing tree and planting it so probably the only option is to buy a ready grown bonsai. My local Lidl store has Ficus Ginseng (Money Tree) bonsai for £4.99p.

          To avoid roots like in the picture the thick anchoring roots are pruned and the crown wired to the pot. But quite frankly the malformed roots are the reason for growing them. In Bonsai the weirder the better!
           
        • JWK

          JWK Gardener Staff Member

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          There were plenty more slighty cheaper, I think it's because of it's age :heehee: I don't know but that one must be 40 years old ish. They must sell, it wasn't there the next time I visited :thumbsup:
           
        • stumorphmac

          stumorphmac cymbidist

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          The second picture with the roots could be ficus ???
           
        • Anthorn

          Anthorn Gardener

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          Probably Ficus Microcarpa (Chinese Banyan)
           
        • sal73

          sal73 Total Gardener

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          I know it`s a ficus , that`s why I`m looking for and alternative frost hardy with the same roots behaving .... even if I was reading of actually growing the tree on a stone and slowly with years remove the soil and get the roots out....I was actually thinking of using a ficus carica .
           
        • Anthorn

          Anthorn Gardener

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          Supplementary to my first post in this topic: The exposed roots are not a feature of the plant but a feature of the way it's planted. It's grown in a container and the anchoring roots have pushed the tree upwards. In a bonsai this can also be done with wiring so long as the thin feeding roots are not damaged.

          Ficus Carica would work provided we don't get Arctic weather like in the early part of 2011 but even then you'll only lose the top growth and it will grow again when it gets warmer.

          If tropical is your aim you might like to consider a tree which looks tropical but is not a Ficus like one or other of the hardy palms. For example the Jelly Palm (Butita Capitata) is frost hardy down to -5C and is quick to germinate in a few weeks if a temp of around 30C can be attained (in the airing cupboard?). This palm is next on my list if I can't get the Pygmy Date Palm seeds to germinate.
           
        • sal73

          sal73 Total Gardener

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          Thank you anthorn , already full with palmas , funny enough tonight I was just try to break few butita seeds to accelerate the germination , about the Pygmy palm already lost 2 big one in the green house and not going to replace.
          Could you explain how to ancor the roots ? that sound really interesting , I`m not so much in bonsai , plus love trees but have small garden , It would be nice to grow some hardy tree and try (I say try) to make them look exotic in some way...so far got ficus carica , Punica granatum , japanese medlar and paulownia tomentosa.
           
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