Question for petrol-heads

Discussion in 'Off-Topic Discussion' started by clueless1, Jun 3, 2014.

  1. clueless1

    clueless1 member... yep, that's what I am:)

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    Dear old Gothilda has a minor fault. I know how to fix it, and it will cost me a few pence and a few minutes of time.

    The small hose that runs from the induction side (after the throttle body but before the manifold) to the fuel pressure regulator has split and now snapped. It means two things:

    1) The fuel pressure is not regulated, so the ECU has to adjust injector timings based on readings from the MAF and O2 sensors, which it has to do anyway, but now it has to do it more to take into account the loss of regulation of fuel pressure. It just means that any sudden change in load or throttle position leads to a second or two of lumpy running as the mix goes lean or rich because the pressure isn't regulated at source.

    2) When decelerating with no throttle, she'll be sucking filth in through the now open hose and worse, when flooring it, some of the pressure generated by the turbo will simply escape, which would explain the new whistle/hum that she does under load.

    I only replaced the hose a few weeks ago with brand new hose, which obviously doesn't stand up to the temperature changes experienced in the engine bay.

    So two questions really.

    How long will she live if I leave her like that for a while?

    And where can I get some decent hose that will take the conditions of the engine bay without perishing? The last hose came from the generic motor factors shop, and it was generic rubber hose, sold by the metre.
     
  2. Fat Controller

    Fat Controller 'Cuddly' Scottish Admin! Staff Member

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    Sorry @clueless1 - I have only just seen this. I take it the hose you are referring to is a vacuum hose?
     
  3. clueless1

    clueless1 member... yep, that's what I am:)

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    I guess so yes. I've realised I might have mis-remembered where abouts in the induction side it connects. I can't remember if its before or after the MAF now, but in essence, yes, vacuum in the inlet manifold transfers via the hose to the fuel pressure regulator, which then adjusts the rate at which surplus pumped fuel is allowed back to the tank, thus keeping the relative fuel pressure constant regardless of air pressure at the injector nozzles.

    Its kind of fine tuning in a way. The ECU does a good job of adjuster injector opening time based on feedback from the MAF and O2 sensors, but of course any sudden change in load, such as if I floor it, or when she changes gear, the sudden change in relative air pressure at the nozzles means the injectors will squirt more or less fuel than the ECU thought. It will of course quickly correct, but not before firing a few cycles on the wrong mix. I notice this mostly when she kicks down, as she hesitates. Exactly as she did last time the hose failed, and putting a new hose on got rid of the hesitation on kick down, but then I noticed the hesitation had come back, so I had a look, and this time the hose hasn't just split, it has actually snapped off completely.
     
  4. Fat Controller

    Fat Controller 'Cuddly' Scottish Admin! Staff Member

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    OK, definitely sounds like a vacuum hose - in which case three properties are quite important as far as I know (hopefully @longk will be able to tell us how wide I am of the mark :biggrin:)

    Firstly, the bore/diameter of the pipe has to be the same as the original spec - variance of the bore will alter the flow rate of the air meaning that it may not 'suck' hard enough to activate/actuate whatever it is working at the other end.

    The material the hose is made from has to be not only capable of withstanding the temperatures of the engine bay, but also has to be able to maintain its rigidity; if it goes soft, it can collapse in on itself due to the pressure inside versus the air pressure outside - - collapsing pipes is quite common on some VAG engines for example, leading to them unexpectedly and momentarily losing power or running like a bag of spanners.

    Lastly, the material the pipe is made of (and any strengthening or sheathing) - as you already know, its got to be up to the job of coping with the heat and the pressures involved, and may even be requiring an outer sheath to prevent wear if its one of those pipes that moves around a lot.

    If the original pipe is not available from Volvo or someone like GSF, then the only people I can think of that would be able to make it bespoke are Pirtek - - but they would need to know either the specification of the original, or details of its purpose in life.
     
  5. Fat Controller

    Fat Controller 'Cuddly' Scottish Admin! Staff Member

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    A bit of Googling suggests that the Volvo originals are an odd internal size of 4.2mm, and the best replacement is one with a 4mm internal diameter; overall diameter varying dependant on the material chosen (silicon, rubber etc) - for my money, I would go silicon over rubber.
     
  6. longk

    longk Total Gardener

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    You're both pretty much on the money.

    As we're dealing with a gaseous pressure or case vacuum and there is no flow as such (just pressure/vacuum difference) the id of the hose is not so important. So a good quality diesel leak off pipe offcut will suffice for now/for ever if it will fit (five minutes in hot water usually does it). Failing that, you'll find something in the local scrappy, or just order a new one from Volvo, although they'll probably want a tenner for it!
     
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    • clueless1

      clueless1 member... yep, that's what I am:)

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      Thanks chaps. I'll see if I can source an original. Or I might pop to a different local motor factors (the one I used has a reputation, and unfortunately its not as good as the good kind of reputation), and see if I can get some hose intended for diesel 'leak off'.

      For the immediate short term though, I think I still have some of the not so great hose left somewhere in my junk cupboard, which I'll stick on just to smoothen her out a bit for now.
       
    • Fat Controller

      Fat Controller 'Cuddly' Scottish Admin! Staff Member

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      I'll ask about at work and see if there might be any lying about anywhere - I assume its not needing to be all that long?
       
    • clueless1

      clueless1 member... yep, that's what I am:)

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      That's good of you:) Off the top of my head, I think its about 1ft long.
       
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      • Fat Controller

        Fat Controller 'Cuddly' Scottish Admin! Staff Member

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        I didn't get near any oily bits today mate - stuck in meetings all day. Bear with me, and hopefully I will get over there by early next week.
         
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        • Fat Controller

          Fat Controller 'Cuddly' Scottish Admin! Staff Member

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          PM me your address please - I have an 18 inch length of 4mm bore pipe that is semi-rigid (it's pneumatic pipe) so won't collapse under vacuum

          Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Tapatalk
           
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