Winter preparations

Do tell us what winter preparations you are making for your tender plants.


It's already been below freezing (-0.5C) one night, so I have started to put mine to bed.

On the left are my Ensete 'Maurelii'. They all came from my propagation effort over last winter. Last autumn I cut one up http://gardenerscorner.co.uk/forum/threads/bananas.55088/ and succesfully produced several more. The large one was clearly from the original growing point of the one I cut up, and the others are some of the pups that were also produced. Last year I cut them close to the ground, but this year I have left more of the pseudo-stem. I will be drying them out, dusting in sulphur powder (to prevent rot) and storing cool and dry. I might even cut one of the smaller ones into two to get some more pups.

I also have a few more Maurelii that I will try to keep growing over the winter in my garden room at 10C - I hope it is warm enough. It's really all an experiment.

Can you do this to other bananas ? I have some Musa basjoo, velutina, Cavendish and lasiocarpa. Will they keep growing at 10C and/or can you overwinter them in a dry dormant state?

I have been lifting some Cannas. The two big ones at the bottom of the picture are Canna altensteinii - its their second year from seed. I just can't get over how fast they grow. And even now all my Cannas are putting out new shoots. I lifted the altensteinii because they should take up less space overwinter as rhizomes. I started to clean off some others - and then got bored.

If @pete doesn't mind - I will repeat some very good advice he gave a while back. Don't cut them to the ground but leave some greenery on to draw the water out of the pots. My thought is that alternatively you can cut them back hard, but you must then remove the damp compost and replant them in fairly dry compost. I gave up doing this as I soon realised I was running out of dry compost. I assume you can cut off all the roots as they won't be used next year - new ones will grow. Is this true?

The next job is gingers. I have never cut mine back in the past and I understand that's why mine have grown very tall and thin. So this year I think I must cut them back - perhaps in the same way as Cannas. Any thoughts on this.

I will have more plants to cut back. In the meantime do tell us what you are doing and why.

 

Altensteinii is quite a beast isn't it Peter, I've grown it for years and am always amazed how large the root stock gets in 1 year from seed

 

I've got all but 2 dahlias dug up and drying out in the greenhouse. I wasn't going to split them til spring but a couple of them broke into 2 parts both with growing points so might pot those little bits up and keep them slightly warmer than the rest.
Even though I had so many to dig up, they were by far my favourites this year (worth the effort,) and I hope to propagate many more next year for friends and family.
Still got the gladioli to do as well, but they aren't anywhere near as precious as my dahlias.

 

Interesting to see the small E. Maurellii Peter.
Do you think they are big enough to survive the winter drying out process.

Mine just rotted last year but I have a new one in a pot this winter, hoping to get it through with a fairly dry pot in the garage along with a few E. glaucum.

I do like to dry pots out before bringing undercover in darkish conditions, not so bothered if I have greenhouse space.

I've been building a new framework over my Strelitzia and Bougie, as they have outgrown the one I have been using the last few years.

Need to sort out overhead cover for the Butia and Washingtonia before we get some real cold nights.

 

That's the big question Pete - I will let you know in the spring.

Luckily, I propagated quite a few last year ( I have got ones growing inside my garden room as well) so I can afford to experiment. A couple of years ago I bought 5 fairly large Maureliis very cheaply at the end of the season. I killed all 5 by heating them up, in spring, in a closed container - they all rotted from the wet. It was my own stupidity. The only one that did survive was a very small one that I had bought earlier. That was pure luck as it was exposed to the same wet, but it just gives me hope that small ones might survive.

Can you dry out other types of banana?

You have completely different problems of trying to overwinter things outside. In N Yorks - we don't have that problem - they won't.

Bilbo - yes C. altensteinii is an amazing plant. I still can't get my mind round this plant thing. Why does Cubanola (a tree ) only grow 4 to 5 inches per year when altensteinii will do 12 feet in a year? I had to dig up the altensteinii as they were distorting my 50 litre pots.

 

All my Dahlias and Canna's in now, still need to clean all the Gladioli off. Begonia corms are almost ready to be put away ..Never seems enough time in the day now I've retired ..

 

Do Cannas need to be lifted?
Or would the be ok with a thick mulch?

This is my first summer that I have grown them

 

I'll be interested to find out also Sirius,my first time too Mine are in pots and at the moment I've just put them in the GH as they are and await further instructions

 

Very little so far! Anything that need winter warmth needs a few frosts first. I have bought the uber tender stuff indoors now though. Eucomis are all lifted and potted up, the Lobelia tupa has its winter mulch of Taxodium leaves in place and space has been made in a sheltered spot for my Clianthus in case it gets Arctic.

 

That's a good point LongK, which has been worrying me. I am aware that Dahlias need frost to make them go dormant. In the past I have dug them up too early and they just started to grow again - taking energy out of the tuber, which they needed for the next year.

I have some gingers, which seem to be happy at the moment. I am not sure whether to cut them down now or to wait till the the top growth starts to die back - but could that be too late?. With many things such as tulips the healthy growth continues to put back goodness into the bulb and the greenery should be left as long as possible until it dies back naturally. This then raises the question of a ginger (or anything else) that is growing in a heated greenhouse and won't die back - do you still cut it back.

There was a large Lobelia tupa growing in Golden Acre Park just outside Leeds a while ago. It must have been several years old, but sadly was missing the next year after a bad winter. The implication being that, to grow outside in N Yorks, it must be a bit hardier than you think.

Sirius - I am no expert but I would be inclined to lift Cannas. A good mulch may protect them from the cold, but I suspect they could be affected as much by our winter wet, making them rot.

Lolimac - I am sure they will be OK if they are frost free in a greenhouse, but as I said above I would either leave some greenery on to dry the pots out or to repot them in drier compost. In my first year I lost several Cannas to rot as I left them in wet pots in a greenhouse. I hadn't left any greenery on. At this time of the year the pots can get very wet with all the rain, and then during the day its not hot enough for the Cannas to use up all that water.

 

Most tender plants (not uber tender tropical though) will take an air frost and recover. Certainly it has never harmed my BoP or Clerodendrum. And the Erythrina seedling which copped a frost last week has black old leaves but nice fresh new leaves opening now. My main reason for doing this is RSM which has been a nuisance outdoors this year. Best known cure for RSM is cold!!

Personally, I would force die back in a cold shed/garage over the darkest winter months and then start them early next year. I am a believer in avoiding growth outside of what would be natural minimum light levels for anything other than houseplants.

I've said it many times. The tricks (in my opinion) are

• to build the strongest possible plant up when in growth. Obvious maybe, but people treat L.tupa the same as other perennial Lobelia. They forget that in it's native habitat it is a prairie plant so it will grow stronger if kept on the dry side, watering only if it wilts.
• Never cut back until the spring. The hollow stems can lead to the plant rotting from the inside out.
• Apply a good airy mulch around and over the base. Let it breathe.

Mine was a year old in the winter of 2012/13 but breezed through it. It was magmificent this year - better than the one at OBG!!!

 

I will be lifting my cannas this wekend and next weekend , mainly so I can get my Tulips planted . I do as pete suggested and leave about six inch of stem on them , and store ( clearly labelled ! ) in a cool dark garage . As Longk , I like my Begonias and Dahlias to have a touch of frost before I lift them . Not sure why , its just the way I was told to do it ! I presume it stops them regrowing as PeterS said.

 

I'm sure that cannas and hedychiums are hardier than most people think! I didn't lift cannas in the UK on improved clay soil, just mulched them with old compost, and I certainly don't lift them here..the clumps are too big. They've taken ten days at between -12C and -17C, albeit with snow cover.
I kept hedychiums in pots in a heated conservatory in UK and rarely had flowers. They're planted outside here, have made enormous clumps and flower profusely. Once they're all frosted, I pile the old stems and leaves over the rhizomes and then clear it away in Spring when the new growth starts coming through. They might get a few methiocarb slug pellets if I'm feeling particularly conscientious
The same goes for Dahlia, Gladiolus murielae (used to be Acidanthera) , Calla and Alocasia.
I nearly gave myself a heart-attack digging up the Ensete maurelii last year and it's even bigger this year, so am going to give it a jacket of dry straw wrapped round with multicouche insulation and pray for a mild winter! Citrus, Luculia, Bougainvillea and brugs are in a blowaway green house on the terrasse and the flowering Plumeria is inside where I can appreciate the perfume. The Acacias (retinoides and dealbata) will have to take their chance now they're planted outside. At the worst, if they're cut back they'll re-grow from the base.

 

I would totally agree John. As I understand it, tubers and bulbs can usually be stored pretty dry - with perhaps just a touch of moisture to stop them shriveling. But as you say all rhizomes, not just Cannas, should be stored slightly damp. In my book on Cannas it states that if the rhizomes totally dry out they may never come back properly the following year, or worse still die. And it states that the bare rhizomes you some times see in a garden centre are not always as healthy as they should be. However my problem is that in the autumn it rains heavily and my pots get so wet that there is a danger of rot.

That's a good point LongK - however much heat you give plants in a greenhouse - they are not getting the light. Unfortunately I have now lost my frost free greenhouse, so its either a heated garden room or outside in -10C.