18th century hotel restoration advice

Discussion in 'General Gardening Discussion' started by Mad Hatter, Feb 1, 2015.

  1. Mad Hatter

    Mad Hatter Much more...Muchier

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    Hello everyone, I've been away for a little while but I'm back with some potentially good news (for me of course).

    A friend of my father in laws owns a small 18th century hotel which has not really been looked after in regards to the garden. I am qualified in horticulture, and my qualifications actually came from an 18th century villa restoration ( I was an apprentice gardener at Strawberry Hill House, Twickenham). I've done mainly Commercial gardening since then, dealing with company roof gardens and private bamboo gardens in the centre of London, and parks and public places here in Sweden. My question would be aimed towards those of you who have any experience of restoration projects, or anyone that can share any tips at all really.

    What things are a "must" when recreating a historical garden according to photographs?

    What should I look out for/be careful of?

    Do you have any advice to help me shine in my first solo project?

    Thank you so much in advance!
     
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    • Sheal

      Sheal Total Gardener

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      A good place to start would be to look at the garden creations of Gertrude Jekyll. Her ideas will give you a good basis to work with. :)
       
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      • shiney

        shiney President, Grumpy Old Men's Club Staff Member

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        If you have good enough photos of the garden when it was looking good, and you want to restore it to the original, you need to study the layout first and then what plants were in it.

        Then you need to draw your own plan concentrating on the design and groundwork first. Also, make another plan for planting.

        you'll need to decide what of the current garden plants/shrubs/trees were to the original and whether they're suitable to keep/renovate.

        Cost will, obviously, play a part so you will need to try and work out a costing. Assuming the cost is acceptable you then need to work out a timetable and see whether you need to concentrate on separate areas first or are able to do all the groundwork and then all the planting. This will depend on the size of the grounds.

        Will you need to use heavy machinery, diggers etc.? Is there access?

        As it's a hotel you can't have it looking in a mess or the clients may not want to return. Attractive plans of the works should be made a feature for the clients to see (display area). That always looks good to clients and may help to get them to book again so that they can see the progress. Good plans also show that the hotel cares and is working to improve itself.

        Good luck. :blue thumb:
         
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        • Mad Hatter

          Mad Hatter Much more...Muchier

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          I'll check her work out! Thankyou Sheal.

          This is exactly the type of answer that I was looking for. Thank you so much Shiney!
           
        • JWK

          JWK Gardener Staff Member

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          Good idea Sheal, Miss Jekyll designed mainly for the UK, some were abroad but I don't know if her planting would be entirely suitable for Sweden (assuming the Hotel is there and not the UK?). She did concentrate on the overall effect rather than the planting, so you could take her colour/form ideas and substitute more appropriate plants for the Swedish conditions. Saying that I now remember that she famously designed a garden for Lindisfarne Castle which may well have similar climate conditions as Sweden.

          Last summer we went to a talk by the owner of a dilapidated mansion and garden, and her journey of discovery, finding the original planting plans, tracking down the plants and all the work along the way. She has written a book and it's a cracking read if you need some encouragement and ideas:

          http://www.amazon.co.uk/Gertrude-Jekyll-Restored-Upton-Grey/dp/1870673808

          Her website will give you a flavour:

          http://www.gertrudejekyllgarden.co.uk/
           
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          • JWK

            JWK Gardener Staff Member

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            • Mad Hatter

              Mad Hatter Much more...Muchier

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              I have a meeting with boss on Monday morning to "spend a few hours showing me around the property and his boat yard"... He has a boat yard! I was unaware but he wants help renovating boats too. This job sounds perfect...

              But let's not get ahead, he hasn't said that I have a job yet!
               
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              • Sheal

                Sheal Total Gardener

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                Good luck Mad Hatter and fingers crossed for the job! :fingers crossed: :)
                 
              • lost_in_france

                lost_in_france Total Gardener

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                Nothing to add to the good advice above but just wanted to wish you good luck in getting the job :fingers crossed:
                 
              • Mad Hatter

                Mad Hatter Much more...Muchier

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                So after a 5 and a half hour interview, I am elated to give you the news that I am now the new head gardener at an 18th century hotel! The boss likes that I have an English way of gardening, rather than the Swedish (the gardening company that I worked for and the others that I have seen are abysmal.).

                The garden area is roughly the size of a half football field, so not too big for me to manage. The garden has been neglected for about 50 years, with the boss starting to tidy up when he took over last year. As a result you have trees that are rotten and leaning at terrifying angles, hovering over the car parks and the hotel.

                He wants me to come up with ideas for little seating areas outdoors that overlook the lake, and to start to create some topiaries for him too.

                On top of that he owns a boat yard, so he would also like my help there. Fixing them up, repairing, cleaning etc and readying for resale. He said that he will train me and have me taking them for test drives! ( It sounds too good to be true!)

                So thank you for your advice, and I shall thank you now for the advice that I will undoubtedly ask for in the very near future.

                1) does anyone know of any anti rabbit remedies? Wild rabbits are very common here and are eating everything besides rhododendrons and buxus. Thanks!
                 
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                • Sheal

                  Sheal Total Gardener

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                  Oh wow! Well done and congratulations Mad Hatter, the long interview was worth it! :dbgrtmb:

                  Being head gardener gives you free rein with ideas and I bet your head is already buzzing. The boat yard will be ideal for winter work when things come to a halt in the gardens.

                  Rabbit remedies...... are they classed as vermin there? First thought is a gun, would you be allowed to use one? Poison perhaps? Fencing that's sunk below ground around the perimeter. They are going to be difficult to eradicate. I had problems with wild rabbits in my previous garden, the only things they didn't devour were Daffodils and Lupins.
                   
                  Last edited: Feb 10, 2015
                • shiney

                  shiney President, Grumpy Old Men's Club Staff Member

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                  Congratulations :blue thumb:

                  If you're overrun with rabbits it can be difficult. Regular shooting is probably not an option as the guests wouldn't like it. Poison is likely to be ruled out under Health and Safety laws. Rabbit fencing is the best bet but it takes a fair amount of work as you must have somewhere around 500m boundary.

                  Once you've fenced it you'll need to get rid of the rabbits that are already inside! Then they should be shot or hunted (type rabbit hunting into Google).

                  As you are sure to need to keep the front access open for guests to drive in you will need to section off the rear garden separately. Good quality wire mesh gates are easily available. You can still fence the front garden but regular control of the rabbits will be necessary. Any nests found would need the attention of a 'ferret man' or whatever you have in your country. Particular attention could be paid to rabbit resistant plants in the front.

                  I was going to give details about rabbit fencing but I've found this extract that I can copy from elsewhere.

                  "Rabbit Fencing
                  Having a good, strong barrier around the garden is key to keeping rabbits OUT.

                  Key factors for installing a rabbit-proof fence, as recommended by the Forestry
                  Commission include:
                  Size of wire mesh – it is important to measure the size of the holes in the mesh.
                  Small mesh - 31mm wide or less, measured on the diagonal – will ensure that even
                  baby bunnies cannot squeeze through the mesh. Anything larger and the rabbits
                  might find their way into the garden. The forestry commission recommend a fence
                  that measures 1050mm (ht) x 31mm (mesh size) x 18g(thickness of wire). A fence
                  of any length is best supported with high tensile line wires, which also keep the wire
                  mesh taut.

                  Hidden barrier – The bottom of the mesh needs to be folded towards the area where
                  the rabbits will approach. There should be at least 150mm/6" of the fence bent
                  down into the ground with turf to cover it over. The rabbits will dig directly where
                  the vertical of the fence is. With the mesh below the ground as well, the little critters
                  don’t seem to have the initiative to move a few inches back to burrow below.
                  Gates are a weak point in defences so it may be worth fitting a gate on a spring that
                  springs shut quickly after opening. Also, if there is a gap at the bottom of the fence,
                  the best thing is to lower the hinges so that the gate is as close to the ground as
                  possible. Otherwise, fix wire mesh or a strip of rubber to the base to help deter the
                  rabbits from getting in the garden.

                  Height - According to the Forestry Commission the fence should be over one metre
                  in height after the bottom has been folded. For lesser protection, 900mm mesh can
                  be used, leaving the height of the fence 750mm."


                  When I put in my rabbit fence I found it most important to make sure the fence posts (ordinary angle iron posts) were in very firmly and that the fencing was stretched firmly between the posts. Don't miss out on making the return of the wire a good 6 inches back towards where the rabbits are coming from. I made the fence 4 inches deep before bending back the 6 inches, which appears not to be really necessary.

                  As to plants that are rabbit resistant. It only took me a couple of minutes to Google these sites.

                  https://www.rhs.org.uk/advice/profile?pid=209

                  http://www.complete-gardens.co.uk/online/online-gardening-plant-solutions-category.php?cat=15

                  http://www.burncoose.co.uk/site/category.cfm?cat_id=2616

                  It's a major project and it might be best to get a fencing company to do the job if the owner can afford it. It never harms to get a few quotes. He can always decide he can't afford it.

                  Good luck :blue thumb:
                   
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                  • kindredspirit

                    kindredspirit Gardening around a big Puddle. :)

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                    Repairing boats is a full time job so you're probably going to have difficulty in combining the two jobs. But anyway, having those two areas of responsibility sounds the utopian job of all time to me. You just need a classic car to swan around in and you have the perfect job from heaven. Well done.
                     
                  • Mad Hatter

                    Mad Hatter Much more...Muchier

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                    Fencing isn't really an option, as they want it to be an open area hotel type deal. To be able to walk into the woods on one side, to the sea on the other, and a restaurant along the east side. They won't allow fencing, I'm certain of it. I once read that a mixture of of lemon, water and elderflower deterred foxes so I was kind of hoping there might be a natural method to deter the beasts. Shooting is also not an option.

                    @kindredspirit haha! If only. There is another guy working full time with the boats, so I will only be part time or 30% for a while, until the meters of snow come and drown the garden.
                     
                  • lost_in_france

                    lost_in_france Total Gardener

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                    So pleased and excited for you. Will you be able to show us what the gardens are like now and how you change them as you go along?
                     
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