Grenfell Towers

Discussion in 'Off-Topic Discussion' started by Upsydaisy, Jun 14, 2017.

  1. Jiffy

    Jiffy The Match is on Fire

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    There was one guy saying that he tryed to put out the fire but the fire extinguisher didn't work and that people were saying it was a accident waiting to happern :sad:
     
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    • Beckie76

      Beckie76 Total Gardener

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      I need to ask a stupid question please!

      It's been reported on the news that the cause of the fire was a fridge exploding? I've never heard of a fridge to explode...what exploded please? (Don't say the fridge) what part of the fridge would explode? (Sorry if I'm being particularly dumb!) xx
       
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      • Jiffy

        Jiffy The Match is on Fire

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        The only thing i can think of would be the condenser or some one put something inside the fridge that shouldn't be in there :th scifD36:
         
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        • Beckie76

          Beckie76 Total Gardener

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          @pete

          As many of you know Kev did 16 years as a retained fire fighter, I have asked him to explain 'hot spots' in a fire, here's what he said....hot spots are pockets of fire, they are awkward to get to, for example if there's a chimney fire there could be a wooden beam in the chimney which will smoulder, you might not be able to get to it (if that makes sense) so it will just burn slowly for maybe days, the same thing occurs in a thatch fire, the same thing will be happening here, I guess where furniture has fallen on top of fires it's just smouldering underneath.
           
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          • Beckie76

            Beckie76 Total Gardener

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            That would be my explaination :sad:
             
          • Fat Controller

            Fat Controller 'Cuddly' Scottish Admin! Staff Member

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            It would almost certainly be a seized compressor or a leak of refrigerant gas which has then been ignited either by something external (lights being switched on for example), or possibly even by the compressor relay on the fridge itself. The refrigerant gas itself has changed dramatically over the years, and since the rules came in to ban CFC's, Pentane is one of the refrigerant gases used. Pentane is a hydrocarbon (made up of hydrogen and carbon), and is not all that distantly related to the likes of butane and propane - and like those, it is flammable.

            Obviously, this is a very rare scenario, however there was one particular brand (one of those I referred to on my "don't buy" list, that had quite a few fires related to them. Given the demographic of residents in this tower, I would not be surprised if it was one of these that was the root cause.

            There needs to be dramatic changes following this, and if I were campaigning for the change, I would be suggesting:

            • A ban on any new residential building over 4 four stories
            • A timed action plan to build high quality replacement housing (and not the modern shoe-boxes that we have seen being thrown up in recent years), and demolish all high rise residential blocks
            • Social housing to be brought back into local authority control, and a return to proper council housing that is affordable and available to all
            • Mandatory registration of electrical appliances (white goods) at the time of sale
            • A minimum build quality standard to be established and enforced for all domestic appliances
            • Mandatory research into internal fire-thwarting materials for all appliances and electronics, with further steps to make those materials mandatory once developed.
            • A government backed scheme to allow the poorer people in our society to purchase essential appliances and pay weekly, without being ripped off by interest rates that are 100% plus. I am not saying that this should be something that costs the taxpayer, and certainly not a free supply of appliances - but, perhaps have a range of 'approved' white goods from various manufacturers that can be purchased and paid for weekly or monthly with the option to have the payment deducted 'at source' for those on benefits?
            • An IMMEDIATE and full review into NHS, Police and Fire & Rescue service resourcing, with steps taken to put in place the required levels urgently.
            This country needs to stop cutting, and start building - - that alone will make things partly self-funding through the jobs created.
             
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            • Beckie76

              Beckie76 Total Gardener

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              • Sirius

                Sirius Total Gardener

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                I really don't think this is a viable option.
                If you limit blocks of flats to 4 floors, then an equivalent number of flats in a 24 floor building would take 5 times the land area?
                How is that going to happen?
                There is already a huge amount of pressure to build on Green Belt land.

                High rise blocks is a world wide phenomenon.
                IMO the UK can't offer affordable housing any differently.

                The Grenfell fire was shocking.
                It appears that building standards may have been compromised. If after an official investigation, this was found to have contributed to this devastating fire, than those are the issues that need to be addressed.
                 
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                • Fat Controller

                  Fat Controller 'Cuddly' Scottish Admin! Staff Member

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                  There is TONS of unbuilt land in this country - the majority of Wales and Scotland is empty for a start, so yeah maybe we should be building on some of this green belt land. Sure, it wouldn't be in London, but it doesn't have to be all that far away, and with the correct infrastructure it could work. Also, don't forget that there are some plots where there used to be one house, which are quite capable of taking a block of six or eight flats.

                  Another factor that has to be considered is the pressure that high rise buildings put on utilities such as water, drains and electric, as well as public transport (one high rise block potentially has enough people to fill 6 double deck buses, and if they all want to get to work at the same time.....)

                  At the very least, if high rise accommodation is to continue to be built then the regulations MUST now be changed to stipulate sprinklers, fire alarms, multiple escape routes and fireproof or fire suppressant materials used throughout - AND all existing blocks should be systematically retro-fitted, or pulled down where they cannot be retro-fitted.

                  We need a NATIONAL home building scheme, of all types, with strictly enforced standards - for too long successive governments have buried their heads in the sand about the housing crisis in this country, whilst farming out social housing (for the most part) to profit making enterprises. It is utterly mad that taxpayers are funding fat profits for private landlords and property management companies; if all that profit was turned back into the system instead, how many extra homes would it build, and how much better could the standards be?
                   
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                  • Sirius

                    Sirius Total Gardener

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                    Building in Wales or Scotland is not really an option.
                    Where are the jobs?

                    Even if additional housing was built on the outskirts of greater London, travel to central London is going to cut into a large part of wages.
                     
                  • Jiffy

                    Jiffy The Match is on Fire

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                    Our local city council said it's now checking there tower blocks, so some good has come out of it, just hope no one cuts any corners :sofa:
                     
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                    • pete

                      pete Growing a bit of this and a bit of that....

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                      I'm a pretty cynical type as a few might know.;)

                      But to think this is all part of a plot to get rid of poor people takes some believing.
                      I saw Jeremy was there today making the most of it, and suggesting this fire would never had happened if we had a labour government:biggrin:
                      What a self harmer that bloke is.

                      I do think the advice of staying put in a fire is pretty stupid, I'd be the first down the stairs, but then there are those who cant make the stairs.:frown:

                      Time this kind of block was got rid of in my opinion, and people should be allowed space whatever your income.
                       
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                      • "M"

                        "M" Total Gardener

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                        Never! :nonofinger:



                        :whistle:
                         
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                        • pete

                          pete Growing a bit of this and a bit of that....

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                          Oh ok then Who am I to argue;)
                           
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                          • Ian Taylor

                            Ian Taylor Total Gardener

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                            I have spent today going round all the tower blocks in Stockport, has they have all got cladding on.
                            It as been so stressfull tenants were angry wanting to know if the cladding is safe on their tower block.

                            Who ever signed off the job should be worried.
                             
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