Unnamed roses

Can anyone tell me the names of these roses please? The first is growing wild and is quite tall (well over 2m, I'd say). The second is in a garden near me and is a shorter. Both get a fair amount of sunshine.

 

The first looks like a Rosa Rugosa, but I am no rose expert.

 

I would say rosa rugosa for the first one too, judging by the size and wildness as well as the flowers and the very textured leaves, but I'm also no expert. The second looks similar to one that I have which is called Minerva, but there are so many roses that I couldn't be sure that one is the same and mine isn't in flower yet so I'm going on memory.

 

Yes the first one is Rosa rugosa, sometimes sold as R. Rugosa 'rubra'..

The 2nd is Rosa rugosa 'Hansa'.. although it may have been sold as 'Roseraie de l'Hay' as the two are mixed up in commerce. They are very similar but the way to tell apart is that with 'Hansa' you cannot see the yellow stamens clearly as the centre is too muddled, but on 'Roseraie de l'Hay' they are visible.
I cannot see stamens on that 2nd rose, so I go with 'Hansa' for that one.

 

Thank you re the Rugosa.

 

Brilliant! Thank you for the id. It is a really pretty mauve colour and I like the leaves too. I must investigate the Rugosa group.