Friends of mine in this village don't need to work and can live on their husbands wage.Why,because their husbands work for themselves so earn in excess of £100,000 so their wives are ladies of leisure{in between taking the kids to private school}and to the after school activities they partake in We could sell our house down here for a large amount and go and live up North where the houses and cost of living are much cheaper.{probably be able to buy a few nice cheap houses with the money}but up north,jobs are harder to find so we choose to stay here and enjoy the scenery we have down this part of the country I was listening to Three Counties Radio yesterday morning with JVS and he was talking about this extra money for parents and one lady phoned in and said it wasn't worth her working as she was getting £1,700 a month from the state for her and her kids so she might as well stay at home in the warm and look after the kids rather than struggle to go to work.This country is going wrong somewhere me thinks
Just found this link that might be of use to anyone with kids... http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/ne...ernment-childcare-costs-revamp-winners-losers
I have always been a housewife. I cook 'properly' (mostly from the garden) look after the kids, any spare time going I use to do jobs which no one else has time for, like being churchwarden, keep in touch with the sick and elderly etc, write a blog. Visit a forum every now and then! This saves: a) needing another car b) having to buy ready meals 3) our health - see 2 4) paying for childcare 5) community funds for all the little jobs which I, and my husband have time for: keeping the drains clear, just for instance. And above all, it makes me (and the rest of my family?) happy. What really bugs me is when men who work and whose wife looks after the kids, have the idea that the money they earn is theirs to dispose of. Wifey must ask, and woe her when she wants some for herself ....
I think Fat Controller has pretty much hit the nail on the head - greed, pure and simple. We don't so much live in a consumer society as in an 'I want' or 'Why shouldn't I have' society. When I was born, Mums didn't get Family Allowance (or whatever it was called then) for the first child, only subsequent ones as it was assumed (quite rightly - in my somewhat old-fashioned view) that if you had a child, it was down to you to look after and provide for it, added to which, few wives worked and even fewer Mothers. These days things have changed, Family Allowance is paid for all childen and there's a benefit which covers just about anything you care to name - all done in the name of preventing poverty. OK, that's fair enough - for people in real need there should be some help available but, perhaps sadly, I was brought up in an age where the mantra was 'live within your means', if you couldn't afford something you went without unless or until you'd saved up for it. Now, we have young single parents, often with several children, living solely on benefits; we have people with horrendous debt problems caused by their own stupidity with borrowing on credit cards and the one I can never understand, is ... parents complaining about the cost of child care? Why? How? It's a conversation I've had with many young colleagues which goes along the lines of, "I have to work to pay for child care", to which my first thought is ... if you can't afford to have a/another child, then contraception is free, you didn't have to have that child in the first place and .. if there's no child, there's no need for you to give up work or to complain about the cost of paying someone else to bring it up for you. The point is, they want it all and they want it now. They want to be parents and yet they want 'their career' as well, the 'why should I give up my job, just because I've got a child' mentality; they want all the latest gadgets and gizmos and since they're incapable of budgeting to save for it, will use the plastic. The want a particular type of house but since they can't/won't save for a decent deposit, again because they want it now, will take on a mortgage which will cripple them for the foreseeable future. When we sold our first tiny house (which we both hated but was all we could afford) we sold it to first time buyers. When we sold our second house, a 3-bed semi, we sold that to first time buyers and our 4-bedroomed house was also sold to first time buyers who said "We don't know how we're going to afford it, but it's what we want" My point is, something (houses included) are only worth what people are prepared to pay for them, if you can't afford the mortgage then don't buy the house (or save up and put down a larger deposit). If you're struggling to pay a mortgage, then why have children you can't afford? It's not up to the Government to bail people out at every available opportunity, it's up to people like clueless1 and the rest of us to take responsibility for own actions.
Again, I mostly agree Fidgetsmum, however have an issue with the assumptions that surround debt. I would be the first to admit that at the moment, my debts are higher than I would like (or even find acceptable), but that debt has not been run up by buying the latest gadgets or going on holiday, it has been run up mostly on furnishings and needed appliances for the home. Just over four years ago, we were in a situation where we could treat ourselves to a new gadget if we wished, with a little bit of saving up, however that situation changed dramatically when our landlords shop caught fire and we were forced to move - our rent doubled overnight. Somewhat ironically, we had just spent a small fortune on doing up the flat we were moving out of, as our landlords were less than useless, and we wanted the place to be habitable - the rent was cheap to offset this, so we would have comfortably been able to pay off the money we had borrowed on the credit card in a relatively short time. To cap matters off, I had just got rid of car finance and bought one, cash, outright - - it then came holding its hand out (about two months before the fire) wanting a shed load of work, which I had no choice but to do; this added another couple of grand to the credit card bill (again, we weren't overly concerned, as it was well within our comfort zone). When we moved, we then had to buy quite a lot of new stuff for the new house (curtains, and a couple of carpets) - this was a struggle, but we managed to get what we needed without borrowing any more; I sold the one 'luxury' that I had (my 13 year old Jaguar XJ), and bought a cheap banger as a run around; then one by one, our household appliances started to fall over (not entirely convinced that it wasn't related to the fire with some of them, but couldn't prove it, so insurance wouldn't have been remotely interested); TV was first, rapidly followed by the washing machine, the vacuum cleaner, the fridge and then the freezer - - we made use of a catalogue that we had used on and off over the years, and for the next couple of years we plodded along managing to get by; by this point however, we were only just managing to make the minimum payments on things, and not hack of great lumps as we had always been in the habit of doing. Cue Mr Credit Card company - due to the change in circumstances (new address) and the increased 'risk' to them, they put the APR up from 12.9% to 29.9% - that was one of the biggest nails in the coffin for us, as we were now paying more every month and knocking less of the balance. Then, our landlords bank pulled the plug on them, which left us looking for a home again, and fast - - that required us to find a deposit, rent in advance and fees of somewhere in the region of £2600 from memory, and then we had the associated moving costs etc; no option but to borrow that, and that will be 29.9% sir, due to the increased risk (I'd love to know what risk, as we still haven't missed a single payment to this day!); And finally, into the new house - again, we needed to get curtains and blinds as the ones we had simply didn't fit, we needed bedroom furniture as the old house was all built in, so again the catalogue came to the rescue - and that is one of the main reasons that we are, and are going to be battling like hell for the next 18 months or so. Don't get me wrong, I would much preferred to have saved and paid for things one at a time, but they all arrived at once, and saving up considerable sums of money when you are paying stupidly high rental payments is nigh on impossible. If I don't do overtime (which is never), my take home pay is around £1800 a month now; my rent and council tax alone are just under £1300; gas and electric - £190, water £20, diesel to get to work £140 - doesn't leave much for savings. The only, remotely gadgety item I have bought recently is the laptop I am using now - however, I needed it primarily for work, and it has already paid for itself in many ways since buying it. And the whole thing comes back to greed - if house prices or rents weren't crazy, we would be instantly better off; if bank APR's weren't stupidly high because of some perceived (but not proven) risk, then we would be considerably better off, if the government wasn't raping my wallet every time I filled my car to allow me to get tow work I would be better off, and if utility companies weren't allowed to make such huge profits we would be better off. We are paying through the nose, purely to pay for the greed of others.
I've heard people say things like this too. Surely if they have to work so they can afford to pay for the child care, then wouldn't their life be easier is they simply decided not to work? Then they wouldn't have to pay for child care, negating their argument that they have to work to pay for the child care. Seems simple enough to me but then I do have a tendency to over simplify at times. Total thieves aren't they. Same happened to me. You sign a credit agreement, a legally binding contract, to borrow at a certain rate. Sure it does say that they can change the interest rate by giving notice in writing, but you kind of assume that any changes will be roughly in line with base rate changes, then suddenly wham! your reasonable rate becomes extortionate. I'm still paying off mine, but the good thing is I haven't touched them in probably 2 years now, so they are slowly going down, slowly.
+1 And besides being able to spend all that amazing quality time with your children (you'll never get another chance), there's also 1) Savings on work suits & dry cleaning bills, car parking 2) Not having to pay cleaners, ironers, etc. 3) Time to do your own DIY, decorating, etc. 4) Being able to shop around, both instore and online. 5) Having time to help out at the local school, etc. 6) Having time to go foraging, homebrewing, preserving, etc. Plus being able to indulge in one's favourite pastimes like gardening! But the government wont support you because you don't want to “work hard and get on” (according to David Cameron).
Mr Mum and I made the decision that I would be a SAHM (stay at home mother). Why? 1) because I didn't have children for someone else to bring up (and, as anyone who has seen the tranformation when their child first goes to school, the fact is, you go from parenting your one child into having to parent a whole schoolful - because your dear little one will pick up the behaviours of every child in that school!) 2) we could afford to (just) 3) investigating the cost of childcare ... I simply didn't see the financial point! Why should I work for, effectively (after tax, national insurance, child care, clothing for work, travel to and from work etc.,) 30p an hour? Staying at home, I could provide home cooked food (healthier and cheaper than ready meals/take-aways); *enjoy* my family more frequently (Mr Mum's shifts would have meant we would rarely see each other if I had a 9-5). I've lived through Mr Mum bemoan the fact we didn't have the big, shiney cars his younger (single) colleagues had (yes dear, but think of the debt they are in; our car is paid for in full) I've lived through the divorces of a good number of his colleagues who were married, both working, with children. I've lived through hearing how their teens have battled through those years - now, all teens have their times, that's their job; I'm talking up a level or three! My family has had it's moments, of course! We've had no extended family to offer advice/support (moral or otherwise) but we've muddled through. I've taken the brunt of other's rudeness: "So? What are you doing now?" "I'm a mother" "Yes, I know that, but I mean ... what work do you do?" "I'm a full time mother?" "Oh!" (Conversation then switched to Mr Mum and I was subsequently ignored) However, I will say this: having the choice to be a SAHM is a modern luxury; you have to be able to survive on one wage for a start. If that wage earner is offered overtime, they are more likely to grab it with both hands (so, you see less of your partner). And, it takes one heck of a lot of give and take on both sides! If you are at home 'caring' 24/7, your other half does need to respect the fact that *you* have had a long day too! Mr Mum was brought up with the "stick it on credit" attitude. I was brought up on the "if you want it, save for it; live within your means" attitude. Within a few years of marriage, we were in so much debt (because Mr Mum handled the finances) I was in despair!! So, I took over the finances. His weakness was my strength and his relief from the stress of it was almost palpable! His mantra? "I earn it, you 'spend' it" Aside from that one time, we've never had any disagreements over money.
I accept that my previous comments were something of a generalisation, of course there are instances where debt accumulates through circumstances beyond anyone's control and yes, if one expensive appliance is going to keel over on you, then chances are another will follow suit and usually when you can least afford it. It's probably happened to a lot of us here and we've had to muddle through as best we're able. Of course at the time, we've complained about our lot, but my point was that these were the things we could do nothing about, they are as Mr. F'smum is so fond of saying, 'all part of life's rich pageant', and we've just had to deal with them in the best way we can. My circumstances were similar to those of Mum, except perhaps for the fact that Mr. F'smum's attitude towards money mirrors my own. We were both brought up in households where money was extremely tight and I clearly remember my Mother measuring out spoonsful of tea to see if she had enough to last the week while Mr. F'smum recalls wondering why his Mum and Dad's favourite meal seemed to be a fried-bread or boiled vegetable sandwich whilst his plate had meat on it. The day we got married (in 1978) we had £30 between us. Mr. F'smum had booked a week at a beautiful hotel in Wiltshire for our honeymoon, but on our first night, looking at the prices on the dinner menu, we realised the only thing we could afford was the eggs florentine (and we both hated spinach!!). So, until we got paid at the end of the month (which co-incided with the middle of our week away), we stayed in this gorgeous hotel then every evening, drove into Chippenham for fish and chips or made sandwiches in our room! Despite saying they'd leave the carpets, the people from whom we bought our first house actually ripped up the bedroom carpets leaving us with bare floorboards (mind you they took all the ceiling rose light fittings too, leaving us with bare wires!) so I remember very vivdly 10 months later, (when we'd finally saved enough to go to somewhere like Carpetright) buying the cheapest carpet they did. Since we couldn't afford a suite of furniture, Mr. F'smum made the chairs whilst I bought foam and fabric and upholstered them and, when the garage door broke, it stayed broken for over a year. We didn't necessarily make a conscious decision for me to be a full time Mum, that there was any other way just never entered the equation. Yes it was struggle but I wouldn't have missed a single day of bringing up our daughters and I think it paid off in so many ways - they were always well behaved (well when they were out anyway!), none of them had to vie for attention in that short interval between my getting home from work and them going to bed; there were never any real teenage strops, certainly no slanging matches and most of all we had fun together, on top of which we didn't feel the need (as it appears many of my colleagues have done - or do) to assuage our own guilt by showering them in expensive gifts we could ill afford at Christmas, to make up for the fact that we weren't giving them what they really needed ..... our time. Mind you, like Mum, I too got a little tired of people's reaction when I said I was a fulltime housewife and Mum, suddenly it was as though I'd had a full frontal lobotomy and wasn't worth wasting the time of day on. I remember the 5 of us going to a wedding, our very young daughters behaving impeccably (probably because they'd been warned of a slow and painful death if they didn't!) and one woman on our table turning to me and saying - in that way that only some people can - "And what do you do?" When I said 'I'm a full time Mum to these 3', her reply was pretty typical "Oh" swiftly followed by "But what do you do?" Mr. F'smum, bless him, saw that I might just give her my 'I do have a brain, have had an 'important' job to which I may one day return' speech and was quick to intervene by saying 'The hardest job of all. What do you do?' She worked for some advertising firm, launched into how important she was, regaled us with how she expected to be made a partner in the firm one day and didn't have time for things like nasty, messy children to which Mr. F'smum's only comment was ..... "Oh - is that all?"
When we got married, our honeymoon (despite me having a massive stash of cash saved up from working all hours for years) was heading off in my 'motorcaravan' for a cheap week away, with only one night B&B in a hotel (and we made our other meals in the 'van'). The money (my money as Mrs Scrungee had only managed to save a little whilst at Uni - Oh those were the days!) was ploughed into our home which required major refurbishment, was affordable on just my salary (got a bit scary on Black Friday when we dropped out the ERM!!). Never got into the 'must keep constantly upsizing/getter bigger mortgages', so have stayed in the same house which was always big enough for a small family, so when I got early retirement it was a gift rather than a financial disaster. As for holidays, we've got 4 caravan holiday bargain short breaks booked for this year, and will probably take a couple of weeks camping holidays. 2 years ago we managed a weeks canalboat holiday and will be taking another one next year - thanks to Tesco Clubcard Points/Deals.
A few years back, I took my boys to an all inclusive week away in Spain on Tesco vouchers! It coincided with Tesco Direct starting up and they totally messed up linking the Tesco Credit Card with the Tesco Direct site. I'd made a couple of large purchases just to get the introductory bonus (3x value I believe). So, I complained politely. The guy was rushing from meeting to meeting, totally harassed because of this huge muck up with their systems and promised a return call. By the time he got back to me, it was with a promise that if I put the transaction through again, as a courtesy, he would give me FOUR times the value in points Then, a muck up with the travel company when booking (too long to go into) resulted in them giving me the holiday for less tokens plus personal taxis to the hotel and return to airport One of the very best holidays I've had with my boys: Thank you Mr Tesco, Mr Cosmos and all who sail in them
