Peri said, Religion doesn't make wars people make wars. Jjordie said, No harm in that you cannot deny someone their beliefs,you should issue the politicians with compasses and point them elsewhere they have brought the country to the state it's in now.
Well said walnut :gnthb: I agree that prisoners relinquish some rights when in prison but this thread seems to being steering towards Muslim bashing (I'm most definitely not a Muslim) which is not what jjordie intended. I have every sympathy with the Australian Prime Minister's speech about immigrants but I think we should be careful we don't go overboard with our comments. The YouTube video is a highly biased presentation based on a lot of false assumptions but that does not take away from the fact that the Muslim population is increasing. Suggesting that we should deport anyone who is less than three generations in this country seems simple rhetoric because it would be totally impossible :flag:. All it does is stir up emotions. Even if you could work out who has been here less than three generations there are too many impossible barriers to deporting them. First of all you wouldn't be able to find any country that would accept them. Then what do we do with someone who has one parent of one generation standing and another of 10 generation standing? Do we deport only half the person? What if a person who is second generation has grandparents from four different countries? I'm all for healthy debate but lets not take things too far :thmb: I agree with walnut about politicians :rotfl: Vote Walnut For Prime Minister :yho: :yho:
Oh our taxes would still be eaten up by British people in the jail system Peri. I'm sure there's more than a few Brits with criminal records! My comments regarding 'prisoners' losing rights refers to ALL prisoners, no matter where they are from, what their religion etc. Your views seem to be aimed at foreigners only?
Excellent post - I'm definitely not Muslim bashing though - if you read some of my posts Shiney you will see I'm all for having ANY law abiding citizen who chooses to contribute to their society around them living in harmony. The criminals, and others who take from society but never give back are from every religion, nationality and walk of life. By commiting a crime, you effectively take away the rights in a certain situation from your victim - you assault someone - you take away their right to feel safe in the street, you burgle a home - you take away their right to feel safe in their own home. You get found guilty - you should lose some rights of your own. Why not allow them to have a painted compass on the wall - but would the British government also allow a picture of Mary? a picture of Jesus Christ? or would they not venture that far through their own fear that it might offend someone non Christian? My problem is with the government and how they tackle these things, not with the people of varying religions and beliefs. Yes, Walnut for PM......the position may very well be availble soon!
I'm shocked at some of the racism expressed in this thread. There is no place for it and I hope the mods do the right thing and remove these posts.
Anyone ever considered that Muslims are slowly becoming the new Jews? Anti-semitism in this country (and others) before WW11 was mainstream and it took the shocking, despicable and "never again" (they said) events in Europe to give anti-semitism a boot up the a***. The majority of Muslims in this country are happy to assimilate and be useful citizens. We only see the tiny minority that are not, because it's a cause celebre of the media, alongside "reporting" on petty minded bureaucrats in councils who seem to have taken political correctness to extremes. As for deporting someone of less than "pure blood" British as Walnut says, where do you start? I think I've said on this forum before, I might well be first in the deportation queue. Yes, I have a British passport, but only because I was born in Northern Ireland. I am Irish going back at least 5 generations, before that I suspect my ancestors were Scottish!
Aaron, don't worry, we won't hold it against you :hehe: :rotfl:. The current theory is that the majority of Irish originated from Mesolithic hunters from Scotland around 10,000 years ago. So your Scots connection is quite likely. Whereas us Anglo-Saxons (I use the word 'us' loosely) come from the area of 'Europe' now know as Germany and Denmark. Or if you want to go back further they reckon that most of those people came from Phoenicia. It is also no good sending the Normans back to France as they were originally the Norse from Norway, Denmark and Sweden. :hehe: :hehe: But I wouldn't like to try telling that to Alf Garnett :lollol: :lollol: :lollol:
I would like to apologise for my Scandinavian ancestry, the rape and pillaging was completely unacceptable.:o However, from heathen ancestry to Christian birth I whole heartedly defend my right to condemn the Muslim infidels, even if they do like Orienteering :wink:
I'd say my Scottish roots are a good deal later than that - probably 16/17th century in a cunning ploy by the English to "colonise" Ireland with "good, honest Protestants" and control/outlaw the "heathen Irish with their Popish ways":wink:. Until independence there were counties in Ireland called King's County and Queen's County - subtle eh? Ironically, the Scottish lot north of the border were the ancestors of some of those in Northern Ireland who are still so mired in their "convictions" to this day :(
As usual once the subject of immigration and race is mentioned we get quite a few remarks of how persons are not really British, as their great, great grandpapy was Dutch or some such thing. Thats not really the issue, I dont care where people come from, its more to do with if they try to fit in, in their new country, most Europeans live similar lives and can blend in well if they want to. But running off to prayer at various times of day,.... walking around in black personal bell tents and turning village halls into makeshift Muslim churches is not my idea of trying to become British. Add to that the rants from the trouble makers amongst them, and you have a recipe for civil war. Also this is not a racist issue, as has been said, its a religious one.
Were is the racism? all I can see are personal opinions. When someone choses to become a member of this country they should accept that we are a largely Christian country and accept this along with the general rules of a Western society. When they break the rules by committing a crime then they should not be allowed the privilege of residing here. How many times have we heard of British citizens being locked up in Muslim countries for minor crimes..... quite a lot. Anyone remember the couple who got locked up for fondling on a beach? hardly a crime by western standards but a very seriuse matter in an arab state. In Muslim states there is zero tolerance to crimes and criminals, certainly no jail privileges.
The problem is Paul that the "do gooders"amongst our society, many whom have no contact with these people, say we should "take the moral high ground" and prove we are better than them,by being more tolerant of their strange ways. The problem lies within. A problem they dont have.
Spot on Pro Gard - if people 'choose' to come here, then in effect, they should also 'choose' to accept the way of life here, have their own beliefs etc. just as we have many religions here in the UK. But.....please don't try to change this country to another version of their own. If people want their own country, traditions and ways to be the norm of society, then go back to the country where it is the norm. Just don't try to change who we as a nation are. If I choose to go work in Saudi - there is certain clothing I must wear, I can't drive - there are alot of restrictions on me as a female - and should I not abide by those rules - there are serious consequences. If I was in certain parts of India - I couldn't walk down the street in a skimpy pair of shorts, holding hands and having an occasional snog with my partner. But - if I CHOOSE to go there, I make a conscious choice to live by the laws of the land while I am there - no matter what my own culture or beleifs allow me.
That's a somewhat simplistic view there, Periwinkle. If there were no God, man would have to invent one (Voltaire) to have an excuse for war. Face it, man is just an animal, violent and often sadistic. And as long as life exists, this planet never has and never will never be a peaceful place. I see no racism - just a good, healthy debate which is, given the topic, remarkably even handed. And we don't do that, Pete? Even as we speak there are Christian churches being set up all over the world and the locals are actively being converted to Christianity. 'We' are just as certain that our God is the one and only God as are other religions, be it Allah, Buddha or whatever. Who is right we none of us will know this side of the grave. :flag:
