3 or 9 goldfish?

Discussion in 'General Gardening Discussion' started by kingfisher171, Jun 8, 2010.

  1. kingfisher171

    kingfisher171 Apprentice Gardener

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    Unsure if this is the correct area to post this, but currently we have a raised purpose bought hexagonal patio pond, 30" at widest and 11" deep. Three fish (4") live quite happily. Our daughter want to give us her six goldfish which are much smaller due to an impending house move. Yes I appreciate some might say the area couldn't or shouldn't support 9 fish, but my view is "why not", I would simply expect them not to grow as well, similar to a plant being pot bound, what is your view?
     
  2. Doghouse Riley

    Doghouse Riley Head Gardener

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    There is a train of thought that the growth of fish is affected by the size of a pool. I don't subscribe to that. If they are fed, they will grow.
    That doesn't seem a lot of water for the number of fish you want to keep. As well as "poo" fish excrete twice their own weight in urine daily. It would be asking a lot of any planting to cope with all the amonia as the fish grow. With that amount of water, their environment is even now very much effected by the weather, more so in the summer, certain conditions result in a rapid decrease in the oxygen levels.
    I presume you've no filter or aeration system.

    Nothing personal, but they're only goldfish, if there's no alternative, carry on.
     
  3. watergarden

    watergarden have left the forum because...i'm a sad case

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    I agree with Doghouse Riley, its actually a myth that fish will grow to the size of the pond / tank they live in.

    I would also suggest that the current "home" you have is too small for 3 fish, let alone 9, please allow me to expand on that.

    Fish will grow so long as there is food available, like other animals fish produce waste, the plants you have will "neutralise" some of the fish waste, but with 9 fish, that will be too much for the plants. Also plants give out oxygen by day, but at night they remove oxygen from the water, again harming your fish.
    If we have a bad winter the water depth of your "pond" being only 11 inches it may freeze solid (My pool had 6 inch thick ice earlier this year)

    Why not put the fish in one of the other 2 ponds you have? (Oh and you would be wise to get a biolocical filter, uv and pump, if you havent got one)

    Welcome to the world of fish keeping.
     
  4. Axie-Ali

    Axie-Ali Gardener

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    Fish WILL become stunted by their environment, but this is not a good thing....often the stunted growth leads to deformaties and distortion in body shape which ultimately leads to death!, yes, they are 'only' fish, but if you care about them then be very careful before putting them in. Coldwater fish require 188cm square surface area per cm of body length, so you can fit more goldfish than golden orfe, and more golden orfe than koi etc... look at the maximum growth of the fish you are considering putting in then work it out from there.
    Most calculations into required space centre around surface area, although depth is obviously important.... you wouldn't keep them in a large puddle!
    Good luck, hope you come to a happy solution
     
  5. Doghouse Riley

    Doghouse Riley Head Gardener

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    Having kept koi for more years than I care to remember, there are several stories I can recall about fish. A fellow member of the Northern Koi Society, had this eighteen inch koi given to him by a little old lady. It had "outgrown" the domestic aquarium she'd kept it in since it was a tiddler. It was unable to turn round in the tank.

    No "stunting" there!
     
  6. Axie-Ali

    Axie-Ali Gardener

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    Fish can grow so large in an aquarium (especially koi) that they do infact 'fill' the aquarium to the point that they struggle to turn round, but if, however you were to remove this fish and compare it to one kept all its life in adaquate conditions you would 'probably' (can't prove, as you have not provided photos!) that it is much broader than the 'norm'.
    I'm not trying to disagree with you doghouse, I'm sure you are an excellent Koi keeper, but, its the mistakes made by us 'lesser keepers' that highlight the problems caused by keeping a fish in a space too small.
    My first experiences at fish keeping occured many many years ago when I was given some goldfish from a friend. In my excitement I added a ghost koi to the brood.....in a 4ft tank!!!!!!, it grew enormous but its body shape was distorted and stunted compared to the 'norm', even though it filled the tank! we eventually dug a pond for them, and then it was taken by a heron.....another lesson learned!
    just because a fish has filled all the available space doesn't mean its growth hasn't been stunted!
    My advice....if you think the pond is too small for the planned fish then it probably is!
     
  7. Doghouse Riley

    Doghouse Riley Head Gardener

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    There has in the past been attempts at providing a formula for the number of fish to gallonage of a (unfiltered) pond. But there's so many variables and the things grow! As has been said err on the safe side.
    An old adage in the hobby is; "A sick fish is a dead fish."
     
  8. watergarden

    watergarden have left the forum because...i'm a sad case

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    ?

    Koi in particular need to be able to swim up and down as well as from side to side, that is the reason that a koi in a small tank will not look (as said) "normal" compared to a koi kept in a koi pond.
     
  9. Axie-Ali

    Axie-Ali Gardener

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    yes Doghouse, I agree, when in doubt!

    Kingfisher, if you are at all unsure then as Doghouse says...err on the side of caution!
     
  10. Doghouse Riley

    Doghouse Riley Head Gardener

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    This is true.

    Koi viewed from the side look decidedly "odd," as they mature their bodies are quite deep in relation to their width.

    As all fish by means of their swim bladder can maintain negative boyancy, they can swim vertically up or down with ease.
     
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