Hard landscaping questions - with pictures

Dear all

As I have had such helpful replies from everyone on here, I thought I'd ask a couple of non-plant related questions, if I may.

1. I have a horrible old concrete path at the bottom of my garden, which looks ugly as it's all cracked, and it's pointless, as it doesn't lead anywhere - it just stops half way up the garden!





I would like to get rid of it, but I don't know how (sadly, I can't afford to pay someone else to do the job for me). I have tried to get underneath it with a spade, and it did shift, but it's VERY heavy (and it bent the spade). How can I break it into small enough pieces so they can be carted off and disposed of? What tools would I need?
Also, how do I get it from home to the tip without breaking the car? I only have a little Polo. What do you think are the cheapest options? I think there's about 10 metres of 50 cm wide concrete path. A skip would be expensive - but is that what it would take because of the weight, do you think?

Any comments would be very welcome - I expect other people have had to deal with these things before?

Also, I have a patio where the mortar between the slabs etc is very cracked and in some places disappeared altogether.



I gather that you can repoint in such circumstances. What tools do you need for that job, and how do you do it? What is the right kind of mortar mix? Do you need to do it on a dry day? How do I get the mortar into the cracks without dripping it everywhere, thereby staining the patio?

As you can see, I am willing but clueless!

 

Cheapest way is a heavy sledge hammer and pick axe, with a 14lb sledge hammer You can break up to 4" concrete. A skip is the only way to get rid.

Crack it with the sledge and lift it with the pick. Personally being trade Id do it with my small makita breaker or a hired hydraulic beaver breaker but the top method will work ok.

As for ree pointing, pressure wash it first and pick out any lose ****, rake out weeds as deep as poss.

Make up a slightly wet but not sopping pointing mix, 1 cement to 3 building sand. I add a slug of SBR to improve strength but this is not strictly necesery.

Use a two builders trowels, or a dust pan and pointing trowel, cut the motar into small sausadge sections and 'chop' these into the gaps using the edge of the trowel.

run an edging iron over to finish, leave for an hour or so then a very light brush with a soft brush to remove any moartar bits and run the edging iron over one last time to finish.

What ever anyone tells you dont be tempted to brush in a dry mix, its a method synonimuse with pikeys and bad diy! it doesnt work as it never sets properly and doesnt consolidate.

If you work carefully you wont get stains, dont smear it or make up a motar thats sopping wet.

Here is a job i did for a customer b4:


After pointing and ree leveling a couple of sunk slabs, wet moartar used, note no staining:

 

Its like you did that just as a demo Paul

 

:D

 

have to agree with Pro Gard thats the only way to do it

paul that pointing looks the like you had the D T S mate (lol) :D :D :D (very shaky)

 

I agree with Pro Gard about the concrete - a big sledge hammer. I removed a similar path of 4" or more thick. In places it wouldn't crack - so I cut the soil away from underneath it. Then it cracked very easily with a small tap at the unsupported end. Concrete is very strong in compression, ie when you push down on it. So even hitting it with a sledgehammer won't always crack it. But it very weak in extension, ie when you stretch it. And thats what you do when you hit it and its not supported underneath.

I put it all in my car (in several goes). I distributed the bits about the car, ie some in the front passenger well as well as the boot. If you are happy to take three 16 stone blokes as passengers in your car, thats equivalents to a lot of concrete.

As far as mortar stains are concerned, I used a damp sponge to wipe off any mortar stains - obviously whilst its still wet. It worked a treat.

 

A couple of years ago I removed all my front driveway and reconcreted it.
The old stuff although rough and cracked was pretty thick, but as Peter says if you can get under it and lift it just slightly and then hit it with a sledge hammer it breaks suprisingly easy.
I used a long crow bar, the longer the better, for more leverage.

I disposed of the whole lot, (40ftx8ft) in my car, took a fair few trips to the local tip, but was a lot cheaper than a skip.

As to the pointing, sounds a bit daft but, in a similar situation, I used masking tape or similar to stop the staing of the paving with the mortar.
But you need to do it in the summer when the slabs are really dry.

 

The paving blocks around the outside was what I needed to mask up, due to dumping the concrete in the middle.
As you can see I did have help. :D

 

Dear all

Thank you for the helpful replies. I am pleased to read that it is possible to do both jobs as a DIYer. I do have help (hubby will help, although he says no at the moment. If I start the job on my own, looking suitably pathetic, I think he'll crack and give me a hand!). I still have a few questions though:

Paul, what is SBR? Why would I need it and where do you buy it?

What does an edging iron look like? And how can I tell the difference between a builders trowel and a pointing trowel? Does it matter?

As for the pointing mix, is builders sand the same as sharp sand? And how do you mix it up if you're a non-professional, in a bucket?

Pete and PeterS, you say you removed concrete by car. Do you drive one of those great big 4x4s the size of a tank or are we talking small family cars here? Hubby would go ballistic if I damaged the car's suspension or broke the axle or something.

Thanks again for the comments and pictures - really cool to see other people's work!

 

I wouldnt try with a car you wont get mutch in the boot and it looks like youve got close on 1.5- 2 tons of concrete to shift.

Get a mini skip. With fuel the price it is, all the tip runs would come close to a skip cost not to mention suspension damadge.

A brick jointer or edging iron as I incorectly call refer to it.

http://www.screwfix.com/prods/22646/Hand-Tools/Bricklaying-Trowels/Brick-Jointers/Marshalltown-Brick-Jointer

Dont woory about the SBR its not strictly needed and I only use it being a perfectionist.

it stands for styrene butiadine resin or something like that and helps to waterproof, provide frost resistance and resist cracking but is sold in 5 litre cans, so not economic to buy for a small job. I do a lot of pointing and rendering and thus always have some in the van.

 

Builders sand is softer and easier to work with, sharp sand is used for bedding not pointing.

Mix the moartar in a wheelbarrow or on a board using a shovel. Dry ingredints first then make a conical shaped pile and make a 'volcano' hole in the middle. Add a smallish amount of water and mix together adding more water if needed.

Its always hard to gaudge a mix properly in a bucket and hard to mix it thouroughly.

 

Rosie. my car is a Mondeo saloon - sort of medium size. I have driven in Africa, where you get real potholes - not our tiny apologies for a pothole that we get in this country. The cars out there take a tremendous beating and still stand up to it. I think we very much underestimate how tough our cars really are.

My car weighs about 1.5 tons when its empty, so an extra half a ton of concrete is nothing to it. In the days of my youth I used to do some weightlifting. One of our members was a rep and had a (not very big) Ford Escort saloon company car. As it was free to us this was the team transport. We used to go to weightlifting matches with five people with an average weight of over 15 stone each (thats over half a ton), and on at least one occasion we carried an extra 1,500 lbs of weightlifting weights in the car as our oppostion said they didn't have enough. Thats more than one and a quarter tons inside the car. - no problem. :eek:

 

Yeah but itll ruin the paintwork and fill it with dust.

 

Paul sweetie most of us lowly gardening mortals have long since abandoned the hope of ever having a clean boot in our cars and it's mostly down to all the plants we keep buying from the garden centres! :D Hel.xxx.