Organic Gardening-pros and cons

Hi,

I am prompted by a discussion earlier this week in which I said I was organic because it made good sense to me.


Especially on the issue of pesticides-namely provado.

It was my belief that it was bad for the ecological balance of insectivorous life to use chemical pesticides to deal with greenfly, because it would also kill their predators-setting me off on a cycle of spraying everything like mad to make up for the loss of them.


Someone said that as Provado is systemic it only kills the insects that feed on the plant and wouldn't affect their predators. Is this true? Wouldn't the predators ingest the posion when they eat the poisoned greenfly?

 

I only use chemicals when problems get really serious. I had a massive aphid infestation a few weeks ago and genuinely don't think I could've saved my roses and a couple of other things without it.

I used a contact insecticide which sounds less scary than a "systemic" one to me - just kills the aphids on contact then stops working, so predators aren't harmed. (I don't know if this is actually true, but I like to think it is!)

 

I once sprayed insecticide on a miniture rose that was infested with aphids. I had closely inspected it first to make sure there were no predators in there. I couldn't see any. As soon as I sprayed I saw a mass exodus of spiders, ladybirds and all sorts, which I just hadn't spotted in there.

Nowadays I avoid the use of chemicals (except Round-Up for the odd bindweed shoot that still pops up). I'd rather get my garden to be as close to a self sustaining, balanced ecosystem as I can. There is much learning still to be done, but I'll get there.

I am slightly opposed to pesticides on principle. I've read various studies about modern agricultural practices having reached their peak of efficiency. If the studies are correct, the problem for the future is quite worrying. They are saying that insects are developing resistance to the insecticides that are in use, so we keep needing more and more potent ones. Some studies have claimed that the toxicity of some modern pesticides is now such that they can't really make them stronger without making the crops toxic to us. To compound matters, because the lifecycle of the crop damaging insects tends to be much shorter than that of the predatory insects, and breeding rates are so much higher, the crop munching insects are developing resistance at a far faster rate than the predatory insects are, so pesticide use on a modern super-farm is now at a point where pesticides can't be made stronger (because they'll make the crops toxic to us), and the predatory insects can't help because the local populations of them have all been poisoned off.

 

Hi Claire

I'm like Andew, I only use chemicals if the problems is serious. I'll usually try to physically remove pests first (by hand or with a bit of soapy water) before reaching for the bug spray.

But just this morning, I've found my lupins smothered in honeydew from aphids that I'd tried to clear last week with a simple Fairy Liquid + water mix. Tonight, it's going to be a squirt of Provado for those little blighters, I'm afraid.

When I do use chemicals, I'm careful not to overspray the plant and I do my best to avoid predators.

I've no proof but I doubt that a predator insect would eat an aphid if it was already dead but still hanging on.

If any real environmental damage is done, I think it's the regular spraying of commercial crops every 2-3 weeks that's responsible. Just look at all those perfect cabbages and caulis in the supermarket, they don't stay that clean naturally!

 

They certainly don't-I watched a prgramme about some of the tricks the packaging companies pull-and frankly I wish I had an allotment.

 

That's a relief John-I thought I was just being stingy-refusing to throw plants out.

 

I have a couple of books all about keeping a natural garden without using chemicals. Some of the pictures of what the authors have achieved are really impressive. I do agree though that sometimes chemicals are called for at times.

That sounds like a good idea:gnthb:

 

I use roundup in my new build garden just to get on top of things , I hope to wean myself of it.
I also use growmore. ( does this do any harm to wildlife )

 

I think as long as we don't use round-up near a pond or watercourse, we don't need to feel too guilty. With the exception of aquatic creatures, glyphosate (the active ingredient in round-up) has been proven (apparently) to be harmless to animal life.

Growmore is just a feed as far as I'm aware, so no worries there I reckon.

 

I don't use insecticides horticulturaly, however I do use large amounts of herbicides and various fungicides.

To be honest the organic thing doesn't bother me as with the amount of chemicals I use and stuff Ive been exposed to if somethings going to get me it will. These days almost everything has potential to cause cancer from engine oil, creosote to sawdust and of course the usual stuff like asbestos. The chemicals I spray are the tip of the iceberg.

 

"glyphosate (the active ingredient in round-up) has been proven (apparently) to be harmless to animal life"

The toxic elements of herbicides, such as Round-up, tends to come from the Surfactants (the detergent-like chemicals that make it stick to the plant), than the Glyphosate active ingredient :(

 

To my mind, chemicals are just another tool in the gardeners armoury. As long as they are only used when absolutely essential, and not overused, Is fine.:gnthb:

 

I always think that organic gardening should be the aim for every gardener though.

Chemicals should be a very last resort once there's no other option.

I worry when I see the shelves and shelves of horrible sounding stuff in the garden centre. I suspect a lot of gardeners reach for them instinctively without even thinking, because it's quick and easy.

 

The problem is, if you want to be totally organic. You have to be sure no one within a quarter mile of you uses chemicals.:gnthb: