Council Tax

Discussion in 'Off-Topic Discussion' started by Doghouse Riley, Mar 7, 2018.

  1. shiney

    shiney President, Grumpy Old Men's Club Staff Member

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    Council tax is based on property values as of 1991! :rolleyespink: Although this is a ridiculous basis upon which to base it there is no real reason why anything different will be any fairer. In the long run the local authority need a certain amount of money so that they can provide the service that they should be doing. They'll never have sufficient money and any system of raising the funds will be fair to some and unfair to others. Basing it on the size of a house and not on the usage of the services seems illogical to me but it's an easier way to do it. :noidea:
     
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    • pete

      pete Growing a bit of this and a bit of that....

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      I live alone, I get 25% discount on my council tax.
      My nextdoor neighbours are 4 adults living in the same house.

      Need I say more ???

      One house further down the road has god knows how many adults and children living in it.

      Should they pay the same council tax as the house with only 4 adults??

      When I put my rubbish out it barely covers the bottom of the bin.
      I've seen my neighbour put her excess rubbish into my bin when I put it out.

      It is down to the services you get from the council tax, and should you pay more if there are more of you using them?
      It has nothing to do with a medieval tax, that is just the name, poll tax, call it what you like it was not a new tax it was a fairer way of collecting council tax.

      I dont think my windows are taxed. :biggrin:
       
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      • ARMANDII

        ARMANDII Low Flying Administrator Staff Member

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        Well, technically, pete, that's not true if the House is yours then the glass was taxed by the Government when bought by the constructor and passed onto you in the purchase price:dunno::heehee::loll::lunapic 130165696578242 5:
         
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          Last edited by a moderator: Mar 8, 2018
        • ARMANDII

          ARMANDII Low Flying Administrator Staff Member

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          Actually, it was a new Tax and was described as such by Maggie Thatcher when she was Shadow Environmental Secretary in 1974, and was included in the 1974 Manifesto,but not introduced in England until 1988/89.
          My problem was that the Poll [Community] tax didn't take into account that one individual income earner would have to pay for those in his family, not earning an income, who lived in his House:doh::doh:. That was what was unfair.:dunno:
           
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          • Doghouse Riley

            Doghouse Riley Head Gardener

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            They only froze council tax because the Government made them.


            In the past Councils have been extravagant with our cash. As an example. About ten years ago I wrote to our top banana at the council and suggested instead of indulging in this annual ****ing contest with other local councils, over "Northwest in Bloom," where each local authority tried to out-do the rest for the best floral displays in parks, on centre islands on in-town dual carriageways and on roundabouts, they put some of the gardeners to work at filling the sodding pot-holes in the roads, or at least plant some flowers in them so they'd be easier to see.

            I didn't get a reply.


            "What were the chances of that happening?"
             
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            • pete

              pete Growing a bit of this and a bit of that....

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              So what do you think is happening with the council tax?;)

              One person in the household is responsible for paying, along with a subsidy from some of the neighbours. :biggrin:

              Also it was the individual that was responsible for paying their own poll tax NOT the house holder
               
            • ARMANDII

              ARMANDII Low Flying Administrator Staff Member

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              Pete. I have no idea what happens to the Council tax, except some goes on the Councillor 's expenses and bar bills.

              That, pete, is just avoiding the reality of the Community Tax by just repeating the Government Mantra when, in truth, the question that should have been asked is.... And how does that individual pay the Tax if they're not earning an income?:doh::dunno: I was not the only House holder who had no choice but to pay the Community Tax for his Wife, sons and daughters. That was what was blindly unfair in the charging of the Tax.
               
            • KFF

              KFF Total Gardener

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              I live on my own in an in an 8th floor flat. I have no bin collection, my rubbish all goes down the same shute as the other 44 flats in my block and lands in a skip at the bottom which is emptied once a week. By rubbish I mean everything, we have no recycling facilities available to us at all.
              Why should I pay the same Council Tax as someone who lives in a house with a garden who gets weekly bin and recycling bin collections.
              We also pay a seperate bill alongside our rent which goes towards all communal areas/electricity etc and this also includes our estates roads etc . Surely we should be getting a discount for this?
               
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              • Carllennon

                Carllennon Gardener

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                My old place was Band C, my neighbours on either side with the exact same footprint of house were band B. When I submitted a claim to have mine changed, they refused and said mine was correct. How can my neighbours house, which was the exact same design, the a lower band than mine?
                 
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                • shiney

                  shiney President, Grumpy Old Men's Club Staff Member

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                  I had a similar argument about my Band Rate. Most of our neighbours have much bigger houses than us (two or three bedrooms more!) and are worth at least 500k more than ours (stupid house prices down here :doh:) but we're all Banded together. When I appealed they agreed that our house was worth a lot less but said that the 'rules' :th scifD36: can only allow them to Band an area and not individual properties - and showed me the 'rule'.

                  All these posts show that whatever system they use it will not be fair to some people :noidea:.

                  Rules are quite often illogical. Until 1977 we had to pay water rates and sewage rates based on our rateable value - but we don't have mains drainage and have to pay a commercial company to take our sewage away :mad:. That would have continued until now if a very large group of farmers in Devon and Dorset hadn't clubbed together to take their local authorities to court for charging for a service that it was impossible to provide for them. The downside of this was that the water authorities (for whom the council were collecting the money) lost an income, that they shouldn't have had anyway, of 60 million a year. They had, of course, budgeted this 60m for infrastructure (and some back pockets!) which then got cancelled. Hence, some of the current problems with water pipes.
                   
                • ARMANDII

                  ARMANDII Low Flying Administrator Staff Member

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                  I agree with that completely,KFF. We had a new neighbour move into our cul-de-sac in 2010, which only has 6 houses in it [5 & 3 Bedroom], and she realised that, having moved from only a mile away from a 3 bedroom house to another 3 bedroom house that she was paying higher rates. So she rang the Council who sent a Rates Assessor around. He decided that the 3 bedroom houses were paying too much rates but the 4 bedroom rates were correct. Since, I bought my house [3 bedroom] as new build in '78 I got all the overpaid money back that I'd paid over those years without an argument. The strange thing is though, mine is a semi detached house but, to my right, my neighbour's house which is identical to me but detached has had to keep paying the higher rate........where's the sense in that?:doh::scratch:. The whole rating system needs over hauling with Councils being made to reassess Flats, small houses [1 or 2 bedroom] etc. The only problem to that is that Councils will probably take the rates, for al,l even higher.
                   
                • "M"

                  "M" Total Gardener

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                  While some construction workers may well be gardeners, gardeners are not necessarily construction workers. ;)

                  There is empirical evidence which would support the use of floral displays. They act as a positive means of raising the moral of the locals, encouraging visitors (ego the local economy) and, also, reducing crime. It isn't really about local authorities trying to out-do one another (although, there is an argument regarding healthy competition - especially in a capitalist environment - whereby foot-fall has an impact on local economy). It is far more subtle than that.

                  I would happily re-visit Swansea for the lasting memory it left me with last year. As a gardener, I thought this road side/verge display (paid for in Council Taxes) was truly beautiful:

                  DSCN0400 (1024x768).jpg

                  A joy to see! :thumbsup:

                  Did I spend that bit longer there? Yes, of course I did ... couldn't leave without a photo :heehee: Did it make me feel good? Absolutely! Did I spend more? To be honest, yes! I wanted to "spend" time (and sheckles) *because* it made me feel good. Would I go back? Yes! Because it was a beautiful place to travel along and gave an optimistic sense of a great place to be!

                  Pot holes are, of course, an issue. Not one for gardeners though.
                   
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                  • Doghouse Riley

                    Doghouse Riley Head Gardener

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                    In 2013, my Council Tax was £1312.20.

                    I was shocked to find in the notice I received at the beginning of 2014 that this had increased to £2121.16.

                    So I was straight onto the council to register my disgust and dismay at such a huge increase.

                    I nice young lady in the valuations office, explained that if I checked the advice again I'd see the letters "CR" after the £2121.16.
                    I was actually going to get a refund of this amount due to me being put on the wrong band in 1996.
                     
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                      Last edited: Mar 9, 2018
                    • HarryS

                      HarryS Eternally Optimistic Gardener

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                      I worked in Warrington , the big roundabouts as you came off the M6 and up the dual carriageway , were all planted with meadow flowers . At the right time of the year this was amazing . We always need to put a bit of cash into keeping your locale a touch smarter.:blue thumb:
                       
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                      • "M"

                        "M" Total Gardener

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                        My outlaws lived quite close to there! I'm no stranger to it :)
                        Quite! :blue thumb:
                         
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