Electric cars.

Discussion in 'Off-Topic Discussion' started by pete, Apr 7, 2021.

  1. fairygirl

    fairygirl Total Gardener

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    I agree with you @simone_in_wiltshire , as well as with many of the other comments already made. It's well known that the creation and disposal of the batteries is a disaster.
    The problem is - no one seems to work anything out for the long term future any more. 5 years ahead seems to be about as far as they can manage to look, if that. It'll be someone else's problem by then...
     
  2. Stephen Southwest

    Stephen Southwest Gardener

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    There are some hopeful signs - Cornish water lithium mining, V2H and V2G, load management battery banks made up of old BEV batteries, increasingly efficient battery recycling, BEV batteries lasting longer and longer, the emerging BEV battery cell replacement and repair businesses...
     
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    • KT53

      KT53 Gardener

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      Irrespective of the range a battery may have, we need to get away from being virtually entirely dependent on China for supply. Any item with a single source of supply should be of concern. If that single source is China we should be very worried.
       
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      • gks

        gks Total Gardener

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        Are those buses fully electric?

        These new models by BYD only have small batteries with a range of 55-120km depending on the model. It's these new 5th generation engines that they say where it preforms on mileage. If they say it is capable of doing 100km to 2.9L of fuel, that is putting it at being capable of doing just over 90mpg.

        They said in reports that BYD had overtaken Tesla as being ranked N01 in sales of electric cars, but as Tesla don't do PHEV then the report is misleading. BYD are selling more PHEV than BEV and that gap is widening, so even the Chinese are not totally convinced with the BEV market.
         
        Last edited: May 31, 2024
      • gks

        gks Total Gardener

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        To late in the day for that, the horse as well and truly bolted. European policies can take bulk of the blame. Europe as a continent imports more C02 emissions than any other continent, Sweden can have bragging rights of reducing their C02 emissions per capita internally in Europe, but by doing so they they have one of the highest carbon footprints on imports.
         
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          Last edited: May 31, 2024
        • Fat Controller

          Fat Controller 'Cuddly' Scottish Admin! Staff Member

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          Yes, fully electric. There was mutterings when we got the batches that we got that they would retrofit to higher capacity batteries, but the running gear itself is likely involved. There is a whole lot of fluff around the figures though - so the quoted figures will be without saloon lighting, saloon ventilation, cab heating and so on. They already don't heat the saloons, which constantly amazes me that it hasn't resulted in complaints.
           
        • AcerObsessed

          AcerObsessed Apprentice Gardener

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          I completely agree. A relative had one and regretted it. Not only that, but the other thing they are attempting to hide is that if it breaks down (which many have), with no power to the car, you're locked in. A poor elderly man was locked in his for 6 hours waiting for AA to get to him. He was OK, but so many things could have happened. Frightening.
           
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          • DiggersJo

            DiggersJo Head Gardener

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            Fuel (electric) costs nothing if you have your own solar supply. But I'm sure any government will look at getting your money off you some other way....
             
          • shiney

            shiney President, Grumpy Old Men's Club Staff Member

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            I certainly agree with the second part but not too sure about the first part.

            Solar panels have a limited production capacity. If you're using the power produced by them to charge the car you are taking that power away from using it for other things. So it depends on how much of your production you use elsewhere.

            Also, the cost of storage batteries is still exorbitant

            "The number of homes using solar batteries is currently only around 10,000 as the extra cost on top of the solar panels themselves is a barrier to many people. The average solar battery costs £4,500. The main contributors to solar battery costs are the chemical materials that make up the battery, the life cycle of the battery, the storage capacity and the usable capacity. The return on your investment in solar batteries will be affected by battery capacity, battery degradation, and the fluctuation of electricity prices."

            Those people that don't have storage batteries also get paid for how much they don't use (it goes back into 'the grid') and that payment differs depending on who their supplier is and whether they are under the newer system of Smart Export Guarantee (SEG) or the older Feed In Tariff (FIT) that pays in a different way and is a higher payment than SEG.

            More info here:-
            https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/utilities/free-solar-panels/
             
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            • KT53

              KT53 Gardener

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              Somebody quite recently suggested that electric vehicles should only be permitted to charge direct from either solar panels or wind power. Any other method which draws power from the National Grid is not 'zero emission' electricity. I wonder how far people would be able to drive if that was the law?
               
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              • shiney

                shiney President, Grumpy Old Men's Club Staff Member

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                I think that's an illogical premise if those people are also advocating that everyone should do their best to only use zero emission electricity. I guess they would like everyone to go over to electric cars without looking at the situation where a considerable amount of the population would be unable to use solar or wind power.

                You need the infrastructure to be put in first and that will take decades, if ever!
                 
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                • DiggersJo

                  DiggersJo Head Gardener

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                  If we put in the effort as we did for covid, we might get there quicker... Kids both have electric cars and still sell back to the grid and charge their cars for free, it can work. But we do need the infrastructure and that won't happen unless we have people thinking a bit more. We don't have a car, live very rural and enjoy life, but would do more so if the planet was safer - alternatively get us off here to the nearest other safe planet!!
                   
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                  • shiney

                    shiney President, Grumpy Old Men's Club Staff Member

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                    Golgafrincham? :scratch: :heehee:
                     
                  • Stephen Southwest

                    Stephen Southwest Gardener

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                    It is exciting to see that CCS bidirectional DC home charging is, at last, in sight.
                    Hopefully this will become mainstream in the next few years, with more car batteries providing flexible storage, not just for people's houses, but for the grid more widely. It's been quite absurd that for years it's been only a small number of chademo based chargers doing this on a trial basis.
                     
                  • Fat Controller

                    Fat Controller 'Cuddly' Scottish Admin! Staff Member

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                    I can see why they wanted to trial it to be fair - lots to consider, not least grid isolation in the event of power outages... that side is proven technology, however standards for deployment on a wider scale will definitely have to be agreed.
                     
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