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Fair or not?

Discussion in 'Gardening Discussions' started by Verdun, Oct 9, 2017.

  1. ARMANDII

    ARMANDII Low Flying Administrator Staff Member

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    Oh, Gaaaawwwwd, us Humans ain't Saints!!!:hate-shocked::nonofinger::snorky: The companies who run Healthcare Homes are in it for..........now what it is called????, Oh, Yes,......Money and the bottom line. There are cases where I, and the people I work for, will view the word "stole" as perhaps unsuitable and think "liberated" is the correct definition.:dunno::heehee:
     
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    • CanadianLori

      CanadianLori Total Gardener

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      Come on!!! It was a dead flower head.... and I was the one paying the bills.... sheesh... can't believe you actually wrote that with no hint of being facetious....
       
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      • Verdun

        Verdun Passionate gardener

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        ARMANDII, but I AM a saint :rasp:
         
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        • ARMANDII

          ARMANDII Low Flying Administrator Staff Member

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          " can't believe you actually wrote that with no hint of being facetious...."

          "facetious
          fəˈsiːʃəs/

          adjective
          1. treating serious issues with deliberately inappropriate humour; flippant.
            "a facetious remark"
            synonyms: flippant, flip, glib, frivolous, tongue-in-cheek, waggish, whimsical, joking, jokey, jesting, jocular, playful, roguish, impish, teasing, arch, mischievous, puckish"
          saint

          [seynt]
          See more synonyms on Thesaurus.com
          noun
          1.
          any of certain persons of exceptional holiness oflife, formally recognized as such by the ChristianChurch, especially by canonization.
          2.
          a person of great holiness, virtue, orbenevolence.
          3.
          a founder, sponsor, or patron, as of a movementor organization.
          4.
          (in certain religious groups) a designationapplied by the members to themselves.
          verb (used with object)
          5.
          to enroll formally among the saints recognizedby the Church.
          6.
          to give the name of saint to; reckon as a saint.
           
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          • ARMANDII

            ARMANDII Low Flying Administrator Staff Member

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            Not what I've heard:dunno::whistle::heehee: Just keep taking the Blue Pills and I'll send you an upgraded version of the GC Special Jacket.....

            [​IMG]
             
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            • Verdun

              Verdun Passionate gardener

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            • Perki

              Perki Total Gardener

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              Last year someone dug out / pulled out a scabious black ace and some marigolds from my mother garden :mad: and someone pinch all the pansy's from her cousin's garden. They only live round the corner from me. Nobody nicked out from me from what I know of.
               
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              • shiney

                shiney President, Grumpy Old Men's Club Staff Member

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                Mrs Shiney always knocks on people's doors and asks for cuttings or seeds (carries plastic bags just for that purpose) :blue thumb:.
                 
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                • Verdun

                  Verdun Passionate gardener

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                  Excellent Shiney :)
                  Over the years I have scrounged, begged and been offered cuttings and divisions of plants....it is how I established my own garden. Almost without fail, people have been generous and friendly and I have copied this myself. I regard it as a compliment when I am asked about certain plants :)

                  It is when plants are simply pulled out of the ground or hacked about to extract material that annoys me. Wonder how they would like it if I put my hand in their pockets for loose change?

                  I have a front wall that once housed some treasures......I now grow less attractive things there and concentrate elsewhere in the garden.

                  It is a respect thing.......similarly with a neighbour who regularly allowed his dog to foul by my front gate. I saw him early one morning, waited, picked up the poo and deposited it on his doorstep. Hey presto! No more dog fouling :rasp: (very satisfying though:lunapic 130165696578242 5:)
                   
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                  • Jiffy

                    Jiffy The Match is on Fire

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                    No one has stole from our garden, but our nast neighbour gave us some flowers, Bindweed and Ground Elder then they helped kill some shurbs
                     
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                    • shiney

                      shiney President, Grumpy Old Men's Club Staff Member

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                      @Verdun Mrs Shiney is always very generous with plants from our garden. Visitors invariably go away with cuttings, seeds or even potted plants. When people pop in she quite often takes cuttings for them and then pots them up whilst they wait. :dbgrtmb:
                       
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                      • Verdun

                        Verdun Passionate gardener

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                        That's nice Shiney :)
                         
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                        • "M"

                          "M" Total Gardener

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                          Fits the "Theft Act" if they took the whole plant. Darn liberty too! :nonofinger:
                          Hmm, taking a bit from your plants, if it doesn't kill the plant, wouldn't fit the definition of "theft"; criminal damage, perhaps, but not "theft".
                          There are five points to prove before anything can be defined as "theft". If someone takes a piece of a plant, which does not kill it, it is not "theft" because they have not satisfied the criteria: "... to permanently deprive ... " as the plant still exists. The plant is still there (so, not "permanently deprived") it is simply a part of it which is missing. Hence, theft does not meet the criteria; criminal damage may do.
                          :heehee:
                          It isn't theft; in reality nothing was stolen. Why? Because, there was no intention to permanently deprive the owner of their property ;) Probably wouldn't fit "criminal damage" either, as it didn't damage the plant? :dunno:
                          I took a seed head, from a planter, at a country pub yesterday. I did not damage the plant (no case for criminal damage) and I did not steal the plant (no intention to permanently deprive); the opportunity to ask for a seed head wasn't available and would probably have made me look a few bob short of a shilling anyway. Do I feel bad/guilty/a thief/anti-social/vagabond? Nopey, it was a spur of the moment decision to bring a little bit from a very sad occasion back home with me to commemorate the day.
                          Not necessarily. It isn't so cut and dried. In our @CanadianLori example, she did not "permanently" deprive the owner of that particular plant/"property"; nor did she cause "criminal damage" to it. Neither did I in my scenario.

                          Of course, it is open debate and perception but I've yet to see the theft of a seed head come to court.
                          Ripping out plants though is another matter and to answer the question of the topic; no, it is not "fair".
                          As for what to do with the money? Pick a charity ;)
                           
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                          • shiney

                            shiney President, Grumpy Old Men's Club Staff Member

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                            It would be an interesting argument in court.

                            I would be happy to argue that I had been 'permanently deprived' as that part of the plant is no longer available to me. In particular it may no longer be available to Mrs Shiney and she may have been intending to use that part of the plant either for her flower arranging or for cuttings. If not available for her arrangements (e.g. she has made arrangements for a wedding and a golden wedding in the last two weeks) then the recipients, as well as Mrs Shiney, would have been deprived of them). If not available for potting up then either we would have been deprived or the charity would have been deprived of money as we would not have been able to sell it.
                             
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                            • ARMANDII

                              ARMANDII Low Flying Administrator Staff Member

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                              I hope you washed your hands before you ate Breakfast, Verdun:dunno::heehee:

                              [​IMG]
                               
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