how safe do you feel

I think the fact that we have had a good two or three or four generations reach adult life without too many problems, that never did national service, proves that, that is not the real answer.
A good few of the problem kids are too young for national service anyway, from about 8yrs old up wards.
Much of the young criminals are imports any way, in one form or another, as for our home grown ones we only have ourselves to blame, too soft from the start. Its no good laying down the law at 18, it should start from day one.

Anyway, do the sevices actually WANT these morons, I would hardly think so.

 

thats whats wrong no one wants them,so in other words we just sit back and let them get on with the stabbing and robbing and murder,and causing havoc.i also left school at 15 but had two part time jobs since age 13,started as paper girl morning and night,school holidays ans Saturday job in hairdressers,on leaving school went straight into hairdressing full time.my parents would have cut my legs off if i or the rest of my 8 brothers an sisters had as much as spoken to my elders the way they do now. but this country are a lot to blame,the young louts don't have to work,they sit back and the tax payers pay for them.and what they cant have they steal and rob the likes of your old mother, I'm disgusted with this country

 

I really cann't agree with what your saying Pro when you started your career you obviously had drive and self respect the kids these days start going off the rails through lack of giuidance and parenting from day one, the other morning on the radio kids of 11 and 12 were being interviewed and were proud of the fact them and their mates got legless every night had no ambition to do anything else, robbed supplies from the house, one bragged he walked into a off license picked a pack up and just walked out, these kids need discipline otherwise they are wasted lives,I have taught apprentices have pulled round some hopeless cases that were facing the sack, I was offered a job at a college teaching as the apprentices respected me and not the teachers, their hands were tied and were not allowed to use firm discipline Irefused the job as I couldn't work with their limitations.

 

I think one of the main things is to help the trouble youths (both girls and boys) to channel that anti-social angry behaviour into something good.

Most of the problems are caused by a lack of parent control and discipline something that all children should have from a very early age.

One can not say it's because the parents are too young and don't know any better as I gave birth to my eldest at 17 and right from the start I taught him right from wrong.

I was a stay at home mum (one of the lucky ones) and yes I had all the time in the world for my boys.

They were spoilt rotten (seems the done thing if you come from a big family yourself) but neither of my boys turned out 'wrong' both were always polite and although I dished out the discipline as well as the fun the boys are very thankful how they were brought up and all the time I had with them.

I was never a drinker/soap watching mum I was the wrestling, funny, joking mum and things have not changed and that's why my little niece loves coming round to our house she knows there is discipline and order at our house (sadly something she doesn't have at home) but also knows that there is a lot of love and fun too....just what all kids should have in their life no matter how old they are.Hel.xxx.

 

both my girls are fine, my eldest prim and proper no bother at all, my youngest girl had a few problems for a while drinking and bad company, but since she had her little boy, met a new man in her life and moved to scotland, she has settled down, my girls have never caused trouble with other people and they are both respectful of the law and loving, they have always been taught right from wrong at an early age, like i was. :love:and im sure they will pass it on to their children

 

Thats the key.
Passing on to their children.
I feel a lot of the parents of today don't no how to be good parents.
Because their parents were not good parents.
They have turned into idle fowl mouthed lay a bouts.
Drinking bingo and soaps thats their parents lives.
Scrounging of the state.
The children are 'what you do'
They get paid to have them.
They havn't got a clue how to bring them up.
An example.
A young couple by my Dads have been given a modenized 3 bedroomed council house.
Lovely.
Within 6 months it was a filthy wreck the garden over grown.
Dirty windows.
Bags of rubbish everywhere.
Their answer.
It's not our house let the council do the garden and clean it up.
Whats that teaching their 4 children?

 

Lyn(16-2-08).
The Army is a "gang". They stick together and support each other- they wouldn't be much good as soldiers if they didn't. This extends into covering up for their mates when they're in the wrong. Quite understandable. You don't drop your mates in the sxxt when they're there to save your life. People expect too much from the Armed Services. In that way, they're no different from the gangs that roam the streets. Just a different gang. I think the problem is social. It's all right critizing the "lower class" parents but we've always had the "Hooray Henry" types that can cause as much chaos but there's less of them. Respect for other human beings is probably the answer but how you educate people to that, I don't know. When you have a society that concentrates on money rather than human values, you have many people who think that's, "it's not worth trying" so they relate to people who think like them. I don't think there's an easy answer to this.

 

Everyone knows the problem is social for the reasons you admirably point out Caj the suggestion of national service is a last ditch attempt to rectify the problem our present society has created, the parents wont or cann't do it the police wont or cann't the army is the only hope that these drop outs can be turned around, they have to learn discipline some learn a trade far better than the prospects they have now.

 

When there is a problem that no-one else can solve or cope with the army are brought in.
I obviously have a higher regard for them than others.
I think they do a good job.
We would be in an even bigger mess without them.
They are trained professionals.
I don't always agree with some of the things you hear about the army , but that happends every where in all walks of life.
If I had a child who was out of control.
That no -one could reach.
In risk of drugs violence and prison.
I would prefer they were in the 'army gang' than a street gang.

 

Well, Lyn. You agree that it's not down to parents. Otherwise you wouldn't have a child that was out of control, would you? You'd sort it out. I'm not critiziing the Armed Forces, just saying we expect too much from them. They are trained to fight wars, that means sticking together and killing people. That's their job. To expect them to then "peace-keep" is nonsense. To rely on them to enforce societies ideas of what is right and wrong is unfair. We all vote. Vote for the party that agrees with what you want. If there isn't such a party, start your own. All these arguments remind me of my parents generation, (I'm 60) they all wanted National Service brought back so we'd get our hair cut!! It's a different world, guys, move on

 

these are not arguments just different views on a society that is more than getting out of hand and looking at where people think the problem starts and and how do we help reduce teenage and youth crime.it is a different world now and as soon as we get to grips with this problem the better.. i know people who cant just simply move on as they have lost love ones to violent crime or are simply just to scared to go out at night

 

I do feel it's the parents in the early years, who else could it be.
It's also the lack of discipline and respect in schools and in society in general.
If all else fails a spell in the army is I feel the only way to go.
The army do much more than just fight and kill. :D
It's no good sitting back and saying it's a different world.
Thats giving in to them.
Thats the problem.
To many people turning a blind eye.
The not in my garden syndrome.
The heart ache and devastation these young people can cause to a family is unexceptable.
Why should they be let alone to get on and ruin lives?

 

I quite agree that a spell in the army would be good for these out of control teenagers, but lets face it, its 9, 10, 11 year olds that are starting what can society do with these, they are obviously getting none or very little discipline at home.
My 8 year old grandson is very good because he gets discipline from my daughter and her husband, they wouldnt put up with him been cheeky to them or anyone else

 

For under 16's
Army style boot camps.
They step out of line and they do their time
for a few days.
But the do gooders would never have it.
The poor little things might get upset. :rolleyes:

 

Lyn - I do agree with you. But I think the older they are the more difficult they are to turn around. Thats why I think National Service (irrespective of any other considerations) is probably too late. It may not have been in the past, but kids grow up so much faster these days.

The Jesuits understood ââ?¬Å?Give me the child for his first seven years and Iââ?¬â?¢ll give you the manââ?¬Â, So boot camp for the under sevens. :D