Ukraine

Discussion in 'Off-Topic Discussion' started by clanless, Jan 22, 2022.

  1. Loofah

    Loofah Admin Staff Member

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    Its just a stupid situation all round I can't believe Russia thought this was ever a good idea
     
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    • JWK

      JWK Gardener Staff Member

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      But the conscripted US soldiers didn't want to be there, no matter they had better weapons if the person pulling the trigger doesn't want to. I don't think the Americans were well trained, probably the opposite. The same must go for the Russian conscripts in Ukraine.

      I recall Muhammad Ali famously refusing to fight "I ain't got no quarrel with them Vietcong". Think he was jailed and banned from boxing. If any Russians try the same thing they 'accidentally' fall out of windows.
       
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      • JWK

        JWK Gardener Staff Member

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        They are looking at it from a different viewpoint, being surrounded by NATO and thinking they are about to be invaded at the drop of a hat. They have a point, they have been surprised by Western invasions in living memory, even though they had non aggression treaties. From their point of view the West can't be trusted.
         
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        • Jocko

          Jocko Guided by my better half.

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          The US is currently looking into supplying Ukraine with F16 multirole aircraft according to a report on the BBC News this morning.
           
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          • pete

            pete Growing a bit of this and a bit of that....

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            I agree, conscripted armies only really work when you are fighting for the survival of your own country.

            Fighting someone else's war is not even good for the professionals.
             
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            • pete

              pete Growing a bit of this and a bit of that....

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              Looks like Ukraine has become an honorary member of NATO.
               
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              • Loofah

                Loofah Admin Staff Member

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                Only a matter of time before china start supplying Russia
                 
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                • Clueless 1 v2

                  Clueless 1 v2 Total Gardener

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                  It's the culmination of a long game where Putin was played by his own people.

                  According to TLDR news, Putin gave significant financial favours to certain individuals whose job it was to live in Ukraine and cultivate a pro Russian culture there. They took the money, but instead of spending it on hiring the right people and the right social media infiltration etc, they just pocketed it. Then in all likelihood, when Putin asked for updates, they lied, and told him if Russian soldiers come, the masses will welcome them with open arms.

                  When Putin predicted the war would be over in days, he was probably not being unrealistic, given the information he was likely being given. It's just that he was lied to by his own cronies. This creates an impossible situation, because he can hardly then put his hands up and say ooops, my mistake, and pull his troops back out again.
                   
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                  • clanless

                    clanless Total Gardener

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                    Moscow launched 55 air and sea-based missiles on Thursday - 47 of them were shot down.

                    Putin running out of ammo - when the Patriots are in place - they will take out the 8 that got through this time.
                     
                  • Jocko

                    Jocko Guided by my better half.

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                    There was footage on the news of a huge field with masses of fresh Russian troop graves in the east of Ukraine. Each grave had flowers in Russia's colours. So many young men and women lost to the world.
                     
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                    • Upsydaisy

                      Upsydaisy Total Gardener

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                      Agree @Jocko so very sad and pointless. :sad:
                       
                    • clanless

                      clanless Total Gardener

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                      This is what a democracy looks like - free speech - try this is Putinland and you will end up being escorted to long term free accommodation by the Gulag.

                      0_Teachers-Join-Civil-Servants-And-Rail-Workers-In-Strikes-Across-The-UK.jpg
                       
                    • Clueless 1 v2

                      Clueless 1 v2 Total Gardener

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                      If it's about democracy, then that means we're pushing our ideals on Russia. I thought we were supporting Ukraine because they'd been invaded by their larger neighbour.
                       
                    • clanless

                      clanless Total Gardener

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                      Interesting that war torn Ukraine were the first to offer help when the earthquakes hit Turkey.
                       
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                      • pete

                        pete Growing a bit of this and a bit of that....

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                        Apparently we are depleting our own defences by what we are sending to Ukraine.
                        I only hope we manufacture newer stuff to replace what we are sending.

                        I know the tanks are probably not right up to spec as we have a Challenger 3 in the pipeline, but I'm guessing they will be Challenger 2s up graded to 3.

                        One third of our heavy artillery sounds a lot to me.
                        Again I hope we have some newer stuff coming along.

                        I hope we dont start sending war planes.
                         
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