What is suddenly happening in politics???

Discussion in 'Off-Topic Discussion' started by Black Dog, Oct 14, 2022.

  1. pete

    pete Growing a bit of this and a bit of that....

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    Workers have always been employed by the wealthy, its how capitalism works
    How can you change it, if we were all billionaires we would all have our money stashed in some secret bank account in a tax haven.
    Where exactly would that get us.

    Taxes need to be fair and affordable, in the idea world, and we would pay them and still get a decent living.
    Problems arise when it all goes out of balance.
    They take all our money in taxes and then nobody has any money to spend.
     
  2. Clueless 1 v2

    Clueless 1 v2 Total Gardener

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    You can't and shouldn't change it. To do so would be something like the ideals of communism (not to be confused with fake communism that exists under certain tyrannical regimes in the world today).

    The point is it's a massive, state sanctioned, cross party lie. They tell you that you can achieve anything, but only if you have a good education, which is what school provides. In reality, school teachers just enough English and maths to make it possible to do basic tasks, while also teaching that you'll do what you're told, when you're told.

    If school gave a useful education, then all school leavers would have leadership skills, they'd have the knowledge to question things, and they'd know how to manage finances. I can guarantee that most school leavers have none of these skills.

    So what's next? Some will go on to university. They will clock up debts at a rate of 9 grand a year. They're there because they and their parents have been convinced that it's the only way they'll succeed in life. Then having left, having dedicated 4 to 5 years of their life, and accumulated a debt the size of a modest mortgage, they'll have a piece of paper.
     
  3. pete

    pete Growing a bit of this and a bit of that....

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    All I will say is the old saying, you can lead a horse to water............etc.

    Some kids go through state education and do well, some dont.
    We are not all the same, as much as they like to make us, these days.
    People are individuals, some will aspire to get on in life, some wont.

    I know for a fact, that apart from the basic 3Rs I learnt a lot more after I left school than I did while I was there, but the schools seem to have to teach so many things these days, a lot of which should be coming from the parents.

    Hardly a week goes by without some such person or organisation saying something new should be added to the school curriculum.
     
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    • noisette47

      noisette47 Total Gardener

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      Hasn't the problem been, for some time now, that there aren't enough 'blokes in the street that pay their taxes' but there's an ever-growing strata of people who've never done a stroke of work in their lives but are subsidised by the State. Add to that the financial burden of pensioners and it's no wonder that the books don't balance!
       
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      • pete

        pete Growing a bit of this and a bit of that....

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        Which is why governments like immigration, even if they pretend not to.
         
      • noisette47

        noisette47 Total Gardener

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        The thing is....how many of the 'wealthy' are wealthy because they know/knew how to use/exploit other people and their skills? We've come a long way since the days of the industrial revolution, when the upper classes were just that..at the top. Most millionaires nowadays are ordinary, not even very well-educated people who perhaps had a good idea and knew how to sell it to the masses. No doubt some pass on more of the wealth that they've created than others.
         
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        • noisette47

          noisette47 Total Gardener

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          Legal immigration, maybe, but the problems start with illegal immigration. The figures for the first don't bear any relation to the reality of the second.
           
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          • Clueless 1 v2

            Clueless 1 v2 Total Gardener

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            They didn't get that from their state education though. They were either in the right place at the right time surrounded by the right people, or they we're astute enough to recognise at an early age that state education was not leading them along the right path.

            True story. Mark Zuckerberg, founder of Facebook, would have just been an average kid, if he'd listened to his dad, who tried to get him a job in the company he worked for. Zuckerberg was nearly just the co-founder. His mate, who he was going to launch his small website with, bottled out, believing it would be better to just get a job. Bill Gates, credited with the creation of the CPM operating system, the precursor to MS DOS, which in turn was the precursor to Windows, didn't actually create CPM. It was one of his mates, who didn't know how to market his work. Steve Jobs, founder of Apple, didn't create much of anything at first. He recognised the potential of cheap computer chip, and an already existing operating system, and coupled it with the growing interest in computer graphics, to build a computer that was pretty basic and largely off the shelf, but tailored towards the 'desktop publishing' market. Even today, the iOS operating system is based on an open source Linux clone called BSD.

            In all of these examples we see a common theme. None of them followed the old 'if you work hard and do as you're told eventually you might be a team leader or manager'. In every case they were astute enough to see an opportunity and go against what society said they should do.
             
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            • Loofah

              Loofah Admin Staff Member

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              • vbgr

                vbgr Gardener

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                It looks to me that when Liz and Ritchie were fighting it out it was obvious that she would make a mess of things with her far reaching policies and Ritchie said so. The Tory party members heard her and if they weren’t half there why did they elect her. Why has Ritchie been kept out of the spotlight now that his predictions are proved correct. Surely the right thing to do would be for the 22 committee to change the law on getting rid of the PM within the first year, and putting Ritchie in her place, or are the old establishment of Tories going to do anything except put him in charge of the old country. If someone could explain it to me I would be happier with the Tory party. Perhaps he thinks hasta la vista baby. V
                 
              • Clueless 1 v2

                Clueless 1 v2 Total Gardener

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                I'm just filled with a sense of dread about the future of my finances, and for everyone else that isn't rich.

                Like most rational people, I always find fault with what politicians do. But this is a new level. I can't understand why nobody is bothered. When Thatcher introduced poll tax there was hell on. People couldn't afford for every individual over 18 to pay nearly a grand a year in arbitrary tax, so there were mass protests until she backed down.

                This is worse than that. Poll tax was unfair and unaffordable to most, but you could still work out your cashflow. Right now, we have an unstable currency, we still have rampant inflation, but we also have the added bonus of having literally no way to even guestimate what our monthly outgoings will be from April. Hell, the last few days has taught us that even if the government does tell us their latest plans, we have no way of knowing if it's right, or if they'll just do another U turn.

                As for 'growth', who is going to invest in a country where even at the very top of government, literally nobody knows what's going to happen next?
                 
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                • pete

                  pete Growing a bit of this and a bit of that....

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                  I think she was voted for, as opposed to rich man rishi, because Rishi just meant more of the same, which every one knows was getting us nowhere.

                  I still think her and her partner in crime were just too fast at altering things, which was what created all the chaos, a slow introduction of change could have been accepted, but to dump all that lot in one moment of madness was stupid.
                   
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                  • Loofah

                    Loofah Admin Staff Member

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                    She also forgot to tell the story. Skipping to the gory details at the end wasn't a fab way to tell the public what and why she made certain budgetary choices. With the entire planet in the dark over what she was doing, panic ensued. It's not exactly clear the reason she assumed the world knew what was going on in that head of hers but we've seen the result.
                    I'm certain she's not all there and we can expect more upheaval.
                    I also agree - why on earth would anyone invest in the UK at this point unless to take advantage of the ludicrously low pound...
                     
                  • Loofah

                    Loofah Admin Staff Member

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                    Which now I've said it makes more sense. Truss crashes the economy so foreign investment swoops in and buys everything at such a low prices it can't be avoidded. The side effect is surely that all UK based business is unable to compete.
                     
                  • pete

                    pete Growing a bit of this and a bit of that....

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                    I was suspicious of that vacant expression on her face from the start.
                    She was talking yesterday and she reminded me of a puppet out of Thunderbirds.
                    The mouth was opening, and words were coming out, but at no time did the facial expression change, she is definitely odd.
                     
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